i think your post are very impotant
your office is a few miles from where i live
i am trying to enlighten my dad though your email so thank you you have been a huge help most people think that having bipolor is just a bad mood or a happy mood and that i will get over it if they only knew better i have been sending your emails to my dad to make him more aware of my illness thanks again

I have bipolar disorder and thanks to this newsletter subscription, one month ago I decided to go back on meds. I am on a new drug which actually works and the difference is night and day. Thank you for motivating me to talk to a doctor and get on medication. I never want to put my son through what your mother put you through. I have a job now, paying my bills and even saving money. Without seeing how bad it could get, I never would have made that step. Thank’s again Dave

I’m bi-polar and so is my husband. I ,oved back into my parents house with my two youngest children, see my doctor, take my medications, and volunteer at a church as a secretary. My husband (soon to be ex) is an absolute mess. He will not be honest with his doctor, does drugs, won’t take meds, is paranoid and agoraphobic. Untreated, bi-polar disorder can be more painful than a long drawn out cancer. Treated properly, you can have a great life!

Like Natalie, I am now (only) “in touch” with my daughter my email or regular mail. Its a start.
Two years ago (before diagnosis) she announced I was no longer welcome in her sphere of existence. Somehow, all that is, has been, or will be wrong in her world, is my fault.
Not seeing my Grandchildren breaks my heart.
Just like Natalie’s daughter, If I said “I love you, but…”, she would jump all over the “but” and spew forth nothing but ugliness.
Dr. Phil (I know, but she watches him) says that when you say “but”, you are telling the listener to disregard what you just said. (not a direct quote!)
Might I suggest, “I love you, and” as an alternative?
When the “but” they expect, doesn’t come, maybe it will surprise them enough to listen?
I don’t know…have a great day.
Lori

HI DAVE.

I AM A PERSON THAT IS LIVING WITH BI-POLAR DAILY. IF I CAN HELP YOU, LET ME KNOW. I HAVE GO THROUGH HELL IN HIGH WATERS. I HAVE BEEN MARRIED 20 PLUS YEARS AND I AM VERY YOUNG. MY HUSBAND HAD TO GROW WITH ME LEARNING TO DEAL WITH MANIC DEPRESSIVE BI-POLAR.. LET ME KNOW WHEN YOU ARE READY FOR REAL , REAL , CLEAR DETAILS OF EPISODES.

Hi
My wife has Bipolar disorder. when we were married we didn`t know about it. Since we`ve known and i have become her supporter it has actually been a relief for me now I know why we have or should I say had money problems. We don`t have much but at least we are cought up and arn`t faceing shut off notices and such. She even tried to kill me one night. So now that we both know about it and she is stable we tackle this together through sickness and health .

chuck

Still waiting on an email on some ideas how to convince someone to get help and keep in mind it is easier to convince a woman than a man

Roy Anne – I would be very interested to hear some of your clear details of episodes

Johinta – I go through the raging with my son, it is exhausting and draining. He goes on and on about the same thing. He refuses to take the right meds and admit that he has a problem. When the raging starts it can last for 1-4 hours or all day and the same things said over and over that you have heard a million times before. I am also blamed for ever wrong thing or bad thing that has happened in their life

I can really relate to Melissa. My boyfriend is so mean, but he does it passive aggressively. I feel so un appreciated eventhough there is no telling where he would be without me. I never know what is going to bother him and most of the time he acts like I am the problem. I agree that when they are able, the number one thing they should do is show their supporters how much they appreciate them because we don’t have to do this!

My emotions are different. I have felt that God has a certain irony. I was not supposed to be able to get pregnant because the eggs were not making it thru the fallopian tubes. I marry for the 3rd time, after my 2nd husband having a massive heart attack, who has the worst type of BPD – undiagnosed and untreated and he is the one who gets me pregnant passing this mental disorder on. I have always felt sorry for my Baby Girl to watch her have to struggle with this disorder. I knew nothing about BPD or even that her Dad had the disorder and that it could be genetic as well or he would not have been her father. But I guess it was meant to be and now she will have to struggle with this for the rest of her life and all I can do is Pray for her to do what is needed to stay as normal as normal will be for her because I can’t be there every day of the rest of her life to be sure she does. I was mad at God for a very long time and it took a Psych to help me figure that out. So now I feel differently about BPD and the more I learn, the better I am able to help her but I am in the final stage of emphysema and my prognosis is a few years before the emphysema causes me to die from Congestive Heart Failure. Sorry this sounds so negative but this is my heart on my sleeve today and the pain it feels.

Angela,

You could be right, but in my case, my boyfriend is 48 and sounds a lot like Melissa’s son.

Donna,

Is he under a time of particular stress, say financially or with a job or other issue? I also find that my anxiety depression often is worse when I am sick or have gotten too tired.

David, I agree and have felt all of the emotions you stated, especially the fact that I “didn’t sign up for this.” Unfortunately, the goods modds are cherished, and the last thing I want to do is to bring up my feelings at this time, as we are too busy making up for all of the crap. I don’t want to cause an issue., and I want to cherish the good times. My strategy is that I usually bring things up when she says “I know you are having a hard time with me, and I am making you miserable.” (which happens a lot) Because I get this window of opportunity I run with it. It aint easy, that’s for sure.

Gunzee

I am a bipolar supporter and have been for over 20 years. My husband is a rapid cycler with minor or moderate episodes weekly or monthly. He also has major episodes that usually end with him being hospitalized for up to a month every two years. This is even though he religiously takes his meds, sees the phychiatrist and sees a therapist.
My experience has been that I need to enjoy the peace and good moods when they occur and not do or say anything that could be disruptive or a trigger to bring on another episode.
During the times between the episodes he is so guilt ridden about the harsh treatment and angry outbursts that I simply can’t add to his burden.
To deal with BP on a long term basis it is imperative that supporters have a short term memory for the hurtful times and a capacity to appreciate the good times.
I often remind myself that that I love him and hate the illness. “The illness is not him.” “It is the illness talking and raging!”

Jana,

Well it sounds like you have a good handle on handling the disorder as a
supporter, I am sure it is very difficult but sounds as though you are a
very understanding, compassionate person, I applaud you for that!

Wow, 6months. My boyfirend lasted 2 weeks on meds. Even when I told him that I couldn’t live like this anymore, he just volunteered to move out instead of getting help. If I do go away for a while, he doesn’t care. He can just isolate himself more without anyone bothering him.

Dear Donna,

I can sympathize; my biggest stress is not knowing if my girlfriend who is BP is going to come home in a good mood or not, or wake up in a good mood. She has become terribly disorganized, forgetful (meds today?), doesn’t pay bills, etc. I am sorry to hear the same thing, but I am a bit relieved i a not the only one with these feelings.

Gunzee

Hi, I just wanted to say that I am a schizoaffective disorder supporter. What’s schizoaffective? Well, accoriding to the doctor it’s a mixture of bi-bolar and schizophrenia disorder. The symptoms are the same as bi-polar except with hallucenations and voices in the head. So anyways I just wanted to first of all thank dave for the e-mails. I now know that I am not the only one that has to go through this. The e-mails greatly help and give me the strength to not give up on my husband and stick through it as I do love him very much and we have 3boys. So Thanks Dave. Well, here is the story, in the past few months my husband has been diagnosed with the disorder schizoaffective and is finally after having him go through a big manic episode and getting into a physical fight with my dad(whome is also bi-polar to add to the mix)I was finally able to get a court ordered mental evalution(which didn’t really help, but lead me into getting my husband to talk to a marriage counsler which then talked to a pyschologist and finally came up with a diagnosis). It’s kinda weird how long it can take for a pyschologist to actually listen to you and not just your husband when he tends to be very good at hiding his illness. To add to that his disorder didn’t really come out as much untill he reached the age around 27 I think. Therefore I didn’t think of getting help untill later which could have made it more difficult. Well, in conclusion, I Finally, in some little way at least found some help and found a person to find a diagnosis and get my husband on some meds, which also took alot alot of convincing from all parties. Now that he is finally taking meds after going through a few diff meds we finally found some that seem to be working. He is now able to cope with the disorder, even though he will still from time to time fight with me on taking meds and be in denial that there is anything wrong which is probally always going to be a fight now and agian, but at least hes taking them and does alot better when he is. Anyways, in response to the e-mail, I find that it does at first seem to really help to talk to the person with the disorder about your feelings when they are in a good mood and open minded, and at the time he seems to be listening and is very agreeable, but then when he gets back into his negative bad mood its as though all the feeling and emotions I tried to tell him about just goes in one ear and out the other and we go in circles back to round one. I don’t understand cuase at times he will listen and starts understanding me and for a while does better, but then will go back and do the same things that I thought he agreed he understood. I am just so confused about how to help him and feel as though I can’t help him when he keeps going in circles. I want to move foward not around and I beleive that thing that is preventing him is this disorder is so powerful and gets in his head and he has a hard time looking past it so he can become more stable and learn to save money and have better relationships. Well, I am going to go to a support group and try to get him into a educational class about mentel illnesses then maybe we can both better understand each other and move foward and not around.

I CAN APPRECIATE WHERE YOUR COMING FROM DAVE CAUSE AS I’M WRITING THIS I’M GOING THREW ANXIETY AND I DON’T KNOW WHY. WHEN I’M IN A BIPOLAR FLARE I EXPERIENCE SEVER ANGER AND RESENTMENT TOWARD PEOPLE FOR NO REASON. AND I START THROWING THINGS DESTROYING MY PERSONAL ITEMS AND KICKING WISHING IT WAS A HUMAN TO KICK AND I’M NOT MAD A ANY PARTICULAR PERSON. BUT WHAT I THINK IS ANGER HELD INSIDE FROM THE PAST OR I’M JUST PLAIN CRAZY. THEN I GO THREW BAD ANXIETY WHERE I FEEL SOMETHING IS GOING TO HAPPEN. I HATE THAT FEELING.
DOES ANYONE ELSE GO THROUGH THAT? PLEASE LET ME KNOW

Dear Precious@51

My girlfriend experienced the EXACT same thing on a daily basis, the worry and anxiety for really no reason is still there, but the anger issues have been diminished since she has been on medication.
Nothing I can say can convince her to stop worrying.

Donna,

I had to deal with the nasty comments and terrible words alot. Once she got on meds the nastiness subsided, now we are left with worry and anxiety. If we could find something that would help these issues, we would be great.

Gunzee

Gunzee,

My mom is the same way there is nothing anyone can say or do to get her to stop worrying, she worries about everything all the time, my dad always said if she doesn’t have something or someone to worry about she would worry about not having anything to worry about.

Melissa,

Yes it’s sad, if she won the lottery, she would just worry about something else. Every time we solve a problem, she finds something else to worry about.

Gunzee,
Yeah here too. Although he works 2 jobs, even when he does have time for sleep and should be asleep he takes tylenol PM to sleep and always complains of lack of sleep. Then again, he complains about everything. Is there anything that she obsesses over? For him, it’s basketball and his son.

Hi
i have recently been told that i am Bipolar. this is a roller coaster ride but i didnt buy the ticket for the ride.
i am still young and have children & step children they are all grown but 1 daughter. i have always been a very hyper person, workaholic,i stay very busy when i am not working i was spending all the money i had made on not a thing. this cycle has been going on for 17 years i guess you could say i hit the brick bipolar wall( and of course it happened @ work in front of alot of people ) and know i am needing support for me and my family to get through this. i have been in the hospital 2 different times in 2 months the meds have alot of side affects that i have never felt before in my life.

thanks for the tips i know this should help my husband he has been putting up with me for a while and i can see the stress on his face. he has always cheered me on but i think this bipolar is taking its toll on him. he has been reading the comments also thanks for the comments it make me feel that i am not alone and my husband can relate to someone in his shoes

Metro,
just remember when you are having a good day to show your husband some added appreciation. It’s like making a deposit in the bank so when the rainy day comes, and it will come, he’ll have something to withdraw.

jcwife,
my boyfriend doesn’t feel any guilt either. He once told me after a blow up, that he knows that he shouldn’t have said what he said but he would never go back and apologize. At least your husband goes to a psychiatrist, at least he may get on meds. my boyfriend won’t even go, because he doesn’t think that theres anything wrong with him. He once told his mother that he thinks its something he ate.

thanks Dave for all you’re doing to help in every way. My husband’s bipolar and God knows I have tried all avenues, including what you said today. but he forgets everything after a while anyway, he forgets what’s been discussed, he forgets what’s been agreed upon…he just forgets and i always feel i’ve wasted my time and energy speaking to him and coming up to an agreement, a compromise. i’m tired. maria

what do you do if you have NO ONE to talk to. I am 1200 miles from home an in the 5 yr that I have lived here, I have NO FRIENDS here. My room mates walks away when ever I cry or do want to talk. I only leave my house every other month to go to my Dr. Can anyone help me out..

If you could find a church close by, there might be people who would talk to you there. In the Methodist churches I have attended, there are people who have volunteered to get some basic training in listening constructively. They aren’t psychiatrists or even psychologists, only people who want to serve Christ by making themselves available to people who, like you need someone to talk to. The service is free.

Annette,
I don’t know where you live and what is available there, but my son gets counseling from both a psychiatrist and a therapist for 1.00 and usually most of his medicines in samples from the same organization. You do have to be judged in financial need. Maybe your area has such an organization and someone at a local hospital, social services, or health center could point you in the right direction.

Jo,

Don’t you have family to talk to? if not I would suggest looking for local support groups for mental illness or bi-polar. You can find some online at nami.org Another thing you might want to try is maybe go to a church or find an activity where you can meet people and start talking and making friends. I am sure you can find someone to talk to maybe even a counsler. I know it has to be hard, but hang in their and don’t give up if anything you always have the internet and their is tons of people and info that you can talk with online. Best of Luck.

Open and honest dialogue at the right time is really important. In my case, though, I can’t handle it. My best friend and most loyal, loving supporter is my husband. We didn’t know I was going to be diagnosed as BD when we were married. He knew I had had a couple of bouts of major depression and had a very serious near encounter with death via suicide in college, and a 6-wk inpatient stay at a behavioral care center. But it had been years before and I was on meds, and all looked fine. I was always emotional by temperament, but there were definite highs and lows that we passed through. I ended up, as I grew older, having more extreme mood swings and using alcohol and prescription meds to control major fight or flight living. I ended up twice in out-patient care, and the second time, we were blessed with a doctor who correctly diagnosed the disorder. We were both so scared. While I remained dumbfounded and tried to cope, my husband was online reading everything he could about it. But neither of us really knew what we were dealing with until we experienced several months of a manic episode that at its peak destroyed most of his important relationships. by God’s grace alone, we still have a relationship with his son and daughter (our), but it was a permanent loss re: his closest friends. My three kids (our) were also really hurt by tons of fallout. I had been in therapy for a long time already. We finally got to the root of some emotional garbage when I unburied memories of early childhood sexual abuse. But nothing has explained the messed up brain chemistry. I literally held myself together, I think, because of raising my children. I was an at-home Mom for 16 years, feeling I needed to be very attentive and involved in their lives and available whenever needed. It wasn’t like that for me, and I wanted their lives to be different. They brought out the child in me, too, which was healing as I played with them. But once they left home to go on their own, I was lost and I think my controls were, too. It’s like my brain said, OK, now it’s time to really go to town. When my husband makes comments about his friends left behind (because we had to move and they cannot communicate with him or I go ballistic), or how his relationship with his daughter is different, even though it’s never accusatory or meant to make me feel responsible or that he is angry, I feel like a force of destruction in his life. I feel guilty, I hurt for him, I marvel that he is still with me. I am jealous and possessive. If I feel threatened or betrayed or have been stuffing negative feelings over time about someone, and I get triggered, I fly into a very out-of-control rage because of fixated thinking leading to messed up brain chemistry. So having my husband updaate me about how he is feeling about all of this scares me beyond words. I don’t want him to wonder “which woman” he’s coming home to, I don’t want to hear him say he’s given it his all and can’t do it anymore, or how hard it is for him to live w/o his friends, and that he was forced to choose between me and his kids and chose me because he knew how ill I was. His kids weren’t close by to see, and I put a gag order over my husband. He wasn’t to say anything about me to anyone. He honored that but it cost him dearly. I feel such guilt over all he has chosen yes, chosen, but it doesn’t make me feel any better, to sacrifice because we love each other so much and because we love the Lord so much. He doesn’t want to leave me, thank God, and I don’t want him to ever want to. So now I try to hide the signs if I feel them coming on. I know how to act bright when I’m depressed and have slept all day while he’s worked. I set the alarm to give me enough time to do some chores and shower before he gets home. If I’m angry, I downplay it, and I suddenly have lots to do on the computer for a few nights to isolate until I can let some extra meds (legitimate) to be taken as needed take effect. I pray a lot. Even when I know I’m most rebellious and ugly, God loves me. I’m His daughter. He is the glue of our marriage. We’ve relocated and all was great. But I’ve had to take care of my Mom, 85, and it has been 100% more difficult than I imagined. Mom is a major trigger. Sure enough, given enough time, I became manic and exploded all over her. I haven’t been able to talk to her yet about it and apologize. I haven’t wanted my children to know by experience what I can do, head-knowledge was good enough via written materials. But now they’ve seen the rage I can fly into. They had experienced some of my depression when they were at home with me. But they didn’t realize the depth of it. I managed to pull it together when they were due home from school. It’s amazing what the love for my kids gave me the strength to do. When my husband talks to me, which is rare because he’s pretty private, the way you suggest, it devestates me because of the guilt. We do talk about the disorder but in pretty clinical terms and “just checking” terms. Maybe one day I can get past the feeling that I am a totally destructive person in his life when he opens up about his side of this as my supporter. He tells me all of the time that God has given me to him as a gift and he values me as a gift. He loves me so much and I honestly just don’t get it. But I am so very, very grateful for it. I want very much to minimize the effects of this disorder on him. Like Dave said in one of his emails, “this isn’t the life he signed up for”. But I don’t want to think about where I would be now without him. Marni

Roy Anne

I NEED to know this….it would help so much.

My boyfriend and I are together for 5 years. He is Bi-polar, on meds and seeing a therapist.
He has 1 depressive phase and 1 manic phase per year and the cycle is very regular.
We share a great life, ski, motorbike (live in S France) have a great set of friends and a super sex life…no problems..he will NOT leave his controlling mother (he is 40yrs old) to live with me but we make it work!
He is in manic at the moment. He has spent ALOT of money but that is not a big problem. He knows what he has spent.
He thinks he is God’s gift to women. He has to try and sleep with every young girl in existance, party all the time and be FREE!! He has left me AGAIN because he says I cramp his style, he NEVER loved me, he stayed with me 5 years because he felt sorry for me. I make him angry (we never argue..life is always pretty smooth. He wants more beauty, more excitement, he says such hurtful things…..is THIS REALLY HOW IT MAKES YOU FEEL?
I am so hurt!
He left me last year for a young girl of 19 and came back crying…now he seems to have forgotten all about what he said when he came back.
This is so hard for a supporter…is this how it REALLY is?
Do I just stay calm and out of his way and see if it passes and he comes back again…what would you want me to do?
What do you feel? Is this anger towards a loved one NORMAL?
I want it from someone who knows!!
Thanks for any help here!

Just wanted to add a comment to all you mothers of bipolar sons and daughters. I get annoyed with my mum, if I am honest it is more with myself. You see when things get bad I cannot manage the day to day things and my mum takes over with the chores, asks me if I have paid my bills, if I have bought food, if I have done washing. She doesn’t realise this but in my mind she is saying ‘You are useless, you can’t do anything and I hate the fact that at 40 my mum is taking over I know I need her but Iresent her at the same time. I love her though with all my heart. Everything is so painful at times I thought she was turning my daughter against me, trying to kill me. When she speaks I hear different words like reading between the lines I know my thought are not real my illness but they are real at the time only later when well like a flash back I see the harm and how my mind gets warped. I think that is why so many of us attempt suicide inside we are good caring people with an illness that alters our perceptions. We don’t want to hurt anyone. Love you all.

I’m suffer from BP with Panic Disorder. I’m at the point where the Dr.’s are still trying to see which med is working. The weight gain is atrocious. Has anyone had any luck wiht a med that doesn’t cause weight gain?

I have the same issues. Wellbutrin doesn’t cause weight gain and doesn’t lower sex drive, and Miravam is a good instant med for anxiety and panic attacks. It dissolves against the roof of your mouth or under your tongue and it enters your blood stream immediately. Have had good success with both. Marni

Dear Johanita, Thanks for your heart’s concern. I’ll see you “there”, sister. Marni

Tiffany,
I have left him before, with the lastest being moving to a different town but it seems that it’s different now because he lives with me and that would mean putting him out and where would he go, he has nothing. That may just put him over the edge for real.

Leticia,

Lamictal worked well for my girlfriend to reduce the lashing out and bad symptoms of BP, with no weight gain. She is still left with anxiety and worry however. She has tried Xanax, but it makes her tired. We are going to explore something else for this.

Gunzee,
It is terrible. I feel your pain as he doesn’t acknowledge anything that I do and at times doesn’t acknowledge me or our daughter. A relationship does take two people however for you and I, we carry the weight.

Donna,

I know what you mean. But I am having feelings of “whats in it for me?” at this point. I think the one reason that I am staying is the fact that she will, on a weekly basis, say to me that she knows it is a struggle for me and she appreciated me hanging in there, and on “card occasions” she will alway write something sweet in it that she recognizes the issues I am dealing with. She also told me that she is terrified that I am going to give up on her eventually. But, she doesn’t seem to think about fact in situations such as last night.

Donna,

I am very sorry you are going through this as well. I would love to say “hang in there” and “keep the faith” but as you and I know, this wears thin…

I would always ask my husband from time to time. How are you doing? Feeling ok? I had a rough day how about you? You look upset is something bothering you? I would try any number of combinations. Just before he left me and was telling me how he couldn’t talk to me. I told him I knew it was hard and I know he has said that to me before and that I was always there when he was ready. That I wasn’t leaving him and I would always listen. He just got angry and said I wasn’t listening and I didn’t care about how he felt. I asked how he could think that when I asked him so often how he was doing. Of course I was worried about him. He was nasty and said the only reason I asked him that was for my sake not his. I was only worried about myself and didn’t love him. That I didn’t know what love was. I had always tried when I spoke to him to tell him how I was feeling and not blaming him for my own emotions. Sometimes when my upset feeling came from something he did before I even started to I would tell him I wasn’t angry at him or blaming him and I had forgiven him. It was just I had my OWN emtions to understand and because he is my best friend and husband, the one I turn to to talk to and open my heart to I wanted to let him know that even though I felt changed or hurt I was doing ok and moving on from bad feelings. He ALWAYS took it badly though. Stable or not he would always hear the negative and feel guilty. So I slowly stopped talking about my own hurts and I began to have a hard time telling him how I was feeling for the first time. I was afraid to make him angry and I was afraid of him feeling guilty and becoming depressed. I was afraid he would start blaming me and that is exactly what he did. Now we don’t speak at all and it is killing me. He is gone and has been for almost 7 months. Has a girlfriend and tells everyone I am out to get him. Our children are confused and hurt and devestated and he blames me for all of it. Sometimes I feel there isn’t any way to speak to him without it becoming negative. I have the kids in therapy trying to find a way to be able to communicate with him. What we say and what he hears is always different.

Perphila,

One thing Iam learning is that you need to take care of yourself. I deal with the fact that I don’t communicate or tell her how Iam feeling. I didn’t, at first because of the lashing out (pre meds) and terrible response. Now I do, because I don’t have anything to lose, and started looking out for myself. None of us signed up to be a bipolar supporter, and it took a long time to start taking care of my feelings. Now I tell her how I feel, and she says she might as well kill herself since she is making everyone miserable. I just suck it up and realize if she does do something like that, it will not be my fault. If she doesn’t like how I am feeling she can get rid of me, and I will move on. (She wont because bipoalr people are super dependant)It took a while to regain my self esteem, not feel co-dependant and realize that if I am not happy, I better do something about it. Good luck, we all need it.

Gunzee,
Do you really think that bipolar people are really dependent?

Jana,
Great advice!

Roy Ann,

I totally agree with you. Though my husband has never threatened or tried to kill himself, thank god, I have heard that most people who tell people they are going to kill themselves, especially if they do it on more than one occasion, arn’t really going to kill themselves and they just want and need attention. Usually, if someone is going to kill themselves they don’t tell anyone and that is why most people are always surprised when the tragedy happens. That’s just my opinion.

Donna,

I think what you are saying makes my point; they think they are not dependant, but the problem is they cannot perform the task properly. Until they understand this, it will continue. Case in point, my girfriend wanted to at least keep taking care of the bills that come to the house. Firstly, she threw away one thinking it was junk mail (late fee, earning, etc.), and secondly, I just got my second AMEX bill, but I found the first one still on her desk unpaid (late fee, warning, etc.). But, she still insists she can do it. The sad part is I was reminding her every other day not to forget to pay the amex bill. She has no forethought about the ramification of paying the bills late, only that she has it in her head hat they can wait, as there are other pressing things to worry about in her little bubble.

Yes, David, apparently I experience the BPD emotions and I have not been diagnosed as a person with BPD although I have been seeing the same Psych off and on for years. He has helped resolve a lot of issues with hugest of all making me realize that I was actually angry with God and had been for about 30 years. That was a major issue to resolve. However after bringing my BPD 2 daughter home from the Psych ward yesterday and we were watching TV and laying around on my bed talking she noticed that I was in a manic state of mind, hypo manic I suppose. Then I got to thinking about all the times I had felt that way before and how (before emphysema stopped me from being able to do this) crazy I had lived my life at times, really right on the edge of disaster without even thinking about it, just doing it and didn’t seem to care at all and trying to take it farther the next time. And it makes perfect sense to me know between this emotions email and my daughter’s knowledge and experience of how Manic Episodes go That I have some form of BPD but have always been diagnosed with clinical depression. That explains the 3 ring circus I live in: My daughter, my husband with BPD and myself being the supporter. My husband will not admit he has BPD but I with my experience with others with BPD I could recognize in his actions but blinded to my own disorder. Now my eyes have been opened and I can tell my Psych that I do have manic episodes, just not like my daughter and my husband and he will give me the extra med or 2 I need to keep the mania at bay. So yes, Natalie, while it all seems negative, when you realize what it is and can get help for it there is hope and that is definitely positive.

David,
My husband is my bipolar loved one. He is in crisis and is refusing to go to the hospital. He will probably lose his job if he does and he has already spent and stolen most of the money in our accounts. I have the checkbook and his ATM card, but he still seems to be taking money out and I don’t know how. I asked him for a divorce about three weeks ago because I have just had it. He asked me for a month to prove himself and he has been in crisis since then. He will not get past blaming me for not supporting him. I talk to him and use the exact phrases that I found on the bipolar website, but it isn’t working. He has an appt. with his phycologis next week, but he says he refuses to let me go. I’m going to try and go anyway. I have three children and one is 12 and is having a very hard time with this. I need to protect my children, but at the same time I really do love my husband. I know this is not the man I married. I know it is this disease, but it is destroying me and my children. I don’t want him to die, but he says he doesn’t trust me and doesn’t believe that I love him. I have tried to get his friends involved, but he won’t contact them and won’t answer his cell phone when they call. Help.
Becky

Hi Gunzee,

Has your partner truly admitted to having this illness. Sorry it is just that 99% of the stress I caused my partner was because I did not think I was the one with the problem. I have had bipolar for 20 years been with my partner for 15 years woke up 2 years ago after another suicide attempt waking up in hospital and really seeing my partner, he looked washed out, drained, the tears rolled down his cheeks and with love he said “I don’t think I can deal with this anymore” like a light bulb in my head I knew I was ill really ill and my illness could make me lose the love of my life, in the past I would finish with him cruelly maybe 20 times a year in an episode in a word I was a bitch. But I always loved him, it is still difficult between us because of me but we communicate and I am learning to listen without losing my temper it’s hard the paranoid rage within me is like a sick distorted view of reality i.e. my partner hates me etc then we do a reality check together I try to switch to logic not emotion evidence always proves in his favour I am wrong. It is a daily battle but without my partner I am nothing, he is my strength, my sanity. He says the listening me is a million times better and he says my illness is not my fault. People can change for the better I am not saying cured but improved. Like my partner you have stuck it out only love does that no-one wants abuse I changed don’t give up hope.

Hi Gunzee,

This illness is a real heart breaker. Thankfully I have stopped a lot of the hurtful stuff for 2 years now i.e. no suicide/self harm, no finishing with my partner. I take my meds even when well Seroquel. Lithium did nothing for me but my doctors kept insisting I take it. Diazepam made me high as a kite and again keep taking it was the advice. My breakthrough came when I got a phych that actually listened to what I was saying and found me some meds that work. My partner and I ran a business together for three years, actually I worked for him as I had probs with other jobs. He was trying to help me. My take was it was our business, it was his, his knowledge, his trade and yet I knew best ha ha. It was a Car Repair Shop – I can’t change a spark plug. I hope and pray your girlfriend gets the right help, wakes up to herself and gives you the love and respect you need as a man/human being/father. Get the right doctor/second opinion. Never give up trying to find an answer. It scares me because you two are just like Fred and Me. There are two people, not one – 12 years for me to realise that fact.

Gunzee,
Don’t loose your faith.We both need to acecept that they are who they are, we just fell in love with the other part of them and more than likely they were just holding it together then.

Gunzee,
You sound so overwhelmed. I think that there is some things that we can count on from our loved ones. One is that they are going to have times that they are totally consumed with themselves and could care less about us.
two, they are going to have “pissy” times. We have to know how to deal with this. Ignore them, leave them or not count on them. They are not going to be the connected people that we want them to be. They may say that want to be a part of the family, but act totally different. I don’t include him in anything, that way he can’t mess it up. Keep your life, your interests, your sanity.

Hi Gunzee,

I know I am going to be disliked for posting these comments.

With my partner and I we were heading for failure because of my bipolar, moods, spending, irrational behaviour. I think your problems stem from a balance of power. About a year ago I signed everything we held jointly into my partners name, because I abused every situation. Now I have no leveridge, he is the boss. My family thought I was having another episode, a real leap of faith for me. I realised my abuse of finances was a real concern. My partner is excellent with money. Now he has less stress, he looks after me really well. I have no stress financially or power to abuse. You can tell me I am mad, but for me this has worked out.

Tanya,
I have the house and the credit cards in my name. He still has his own bank account and his paycheck. He would never turn those over eventhough everytime the mortgage is due, I am a nervous wreck because he may have spent the money. I think that he doesn’t want to feel totally dependent upon me but in a way he is anyway.

Tanya,

I understand what you are saying I think. We don’t have financial issues luckily, even though she has trouble controlling her spending. As far as control, I have no choice but to push her to pay the joint bills we have due to our business (or pay them myself), and I have taken over managing the business we have together. I don’t like it, but I have to do it. She can’t take care of these things anymore. She ran out of Ambien, and didn’t refill the prescription, so she slept bad last night. She takes a pill every night, and knew she was getting low, but didn’t do anything about it. I told her to leave me the Rx today and I will fill it. She didn’t even remember to do that. I have the “power” through sheer necessity. My issue is the emotional stuff; the self centereness. I am a divorced dad with two kids, a business, and am a BP supporter. I am never asked how I am feeling or if I am having an issue. When I speak up, I am faced with “I might as well kill myself since everyone hates me.” She has to drive about an hour and fifteen minutes to a client 3 to 4 times a week. It is not a very tough job, but you think she was carrying a cross, and nobody else in the world has to get out of bed and go to work, and believe me, she is getting paid more than a bag of peanuts to do it. Boo Hoo, but if I called her on it, there would be hell to pay. I work out of the office (home) alot. I get her lunch together, bring her computer and stuff out to her car, make her a quick breakfast. I got her a cleaning lady once per week. I do at least my own laundry, and will have dinner ready for her when she gets home, and I still put in a days work. She has it easy, but still has issues about how hard her life is. Fine, the nastyness is gone since meds, but the ramaining anxiety and worry is terrible, and causes her to basically shut down almost every day.

Gunzee,
The emotional stuff is bad. I wonder sometimes what makes him think that he can be self centered. The truth is he does, and somhow wants me to believe that it’s me. It sounds like you do alot for her. What would happen if she had more responsibility for her own life? Would she go hungry? Would she not sleep? Would she not go to work? Somehow we think that if we do more for them, they would appreciate us but it doesn’t and then we are the ones left feeling unforfilled.

Tanya,

I too, am trying to learn from these blogs. If you don’t mind me asking a few questions, what do you think is driving your worry and anxiety? Secondly, did you fly off the handle in the past for no reason, or for inconsequential things? For instance, I did three load of wash for her and the only thing she said, not even thanks, was “you put the hangars backwards! How am I soppuose to quickly take them off the rod?!! I know this is a symptom, but since you have been on meds, to you still feel this rage, even though you may not explode? The worry, anxiety, and suppressed anger are still issues, in that order. Sorry to pry, but I am trying my best to help her.

Gunzee,
You are right. You would think that she would think about you but it just doesn’t happen that way. Deep down they know they would be lost without us but treats us the worst. It’s backwards. My boyfriend actually made the comment that if he had to live with his mother it would drive him crazy. Well, he lives in a nice home now and he doesn’t appreciate it or me. No valentines day card, no birthday card, no mothers day card and a cheap gift at Christmas. No I love you, you look nice, what can I do for you. Nothing. Some days he walks in the house and says nothing at all to me or our daughter. He says that when he gets done talking with those people, meaning at work, he doesn’t want to talk to anyone. You would think that it would kill him to be nice to me or show me something but most days, it’s total shut down.

Gunzee,
I know. I hate it when he comes home early. He once said that he would never ask about my day because he doesn’t care. Can’t get any more plain than that. Anyway, good luck on landing your client. That should make you feel pretty good about yourself. By the way, Easter was the first holiday without drama and disappointment. I wonder if it’s the calm before the storm.

Gunzee,
No, it’s not you. I thought that to when he wouldn’t say a word to us then one of his friends would call him on his (my) cell and he would talk and laugh, you wouldn’t think anything was wrong with him. That’s cause he doesn’t want them to think anything is wrong with him. Sorta, how he did at the many starts of our relationship.

Hi Gunzee,

I have tried to self analyse why I do the things I do. Sometimes I feel like like is a runaway train happening so fast I don’t have time to correct all my mistakes. I unlike your girlfriend cannot work as such, each time has created episode after episode I don’t respond that well to meds. I only take seroquel & tranqs at the moment. I call my probs the bipolar altered state of reality. Lets say you say to me “Your hair looks lovely.” My brain says you are saying to me “You ugly bitch. What the f*** have you done to your hair.” I know this sounds stupid but am aware my thoughts are not real they are my illness. When my partner tells me my hair is nice I just say Oh thaqnks darling no matter what my head says. It is hell. Can you imagine working in an office full of woman with my altered state of reality. I am working on it.

Tanya,

I need to ask another questions, hopefully not too personal. If you were not BP, do you think you would love him just as much, or does the fact that you need his support fuel the “love” factor? I am struggling with this, because my girlfriend is so dependent on me, she says she loves me, but I really wonder if it is because of what I mentioned above, and she is in love with the fact that I am supporting her. Maybe a silly question but you obviously can understand the emotional rollercoaster I am dealing with.

Hi Gunzee

Just wanted to add this altered state of reality is not a permanent thing. Only when it is. That is how I know it is wrong. Like flashbacks my mind when logical recounts these stupid thoughts and thinks what was I thinking but at the time it is very real. Five years ago I was convinced my mum was trying to kill me. How stupid is that. When high which I mostly am I am the sexiest extrovert going can’t stop talking etc. I am lucky my partner loves all of my characters. I tell him when my mind is funny, so he knows why I am moody. He tends to leave me alone then or lifts me out of my bad mood. He is the best ever. Also unlike all the other supporters he does not like to talk about mental health or acknowledge that I have this label. He just says I am unique and hates it when I have to take sleepers he worries about the effects on my body of these meds and wants me to manage without them. I disagree I have the fear of another hospitilisation to keep me popping the meds.

Hi Gunzee,

If I did not have BP. Um I am me deep down with or without this condition. He has loved me unconditional through all the sh** He has given me a fair share of it with his crazy ex, maybe he likes crazy women. I don’t think so I love him because he is always calm, never raises his voice (had enough of that as a child), surprises me all the time with his thoughtfullness. Without this illness our relationship would only be better, so yes I would still stay/love him with or without BP.

Hi Donna,

I understand why if you love someone you don’t want them to take meds. You want to believe he/she is still that successfull capable person. I was like Larry successful career at 19 was working as an oil co exec earning a £25k that was 20 years ago. Now I am on benefits and realise that I still have the intelligence with a huge cog in the works which messes with my personal relationships, say the wrong thing, act inappropriatley, sadly am aware what I do is wrong but have difficulty stopping it and then it is too late, people look at you differntly and you know why. No wonder BP people cry and their loved ones are pulling out their hair.

Donna,

That’s what I struggle with. If she goes in the basement and I do my own thing, what is the point of staying in the realtionship if that happens frequently, which it would in my case? I am really taking a hard look at what is keeping me here. I know someone reading this would say “just tell her how you feel or what you want” but as you know it usually doesn’t work that way.

Tanya,

I would say I would stay with her if she was not BP. I am pretty independent; I run the business with no help, I am a decision maker in all aspects, and finding “companionship” wouldn’t be a problem. Therefore, since I am not co-dependant (altough it seems it!) I am not staying for any other reason that I know there is the person I want under this BP veil. Unfortunately I am wondering how long I can tough it out waiting for the person I fell in love with to emerge.

Hello to everyone:
I have been getting caught up this AM in reading everyone’s blogs as my daughter has been the center of my attention trying to keep her somewhat stable until the meds can help me with it. She was just in the Psych Ward on suicide watch but she has no insurance so they patched her up and released her. But anyways I am writing this to all of you that are trying to understand why you loved one(s) with BPD act as they do. My daughter wrote a bit about it when she was in a hypomanic episode, which led to her Manic Episode and being admitted to the Psych Ward. I posted it on here once but I see we have a lot of new people (new names to me, anyways) so I thought I would post it again exactly as she wrote it and hopefully it will help some of you understand. FYI: She is 21 y/o, BPD diagnosis about 8 years ago.

A Bi-polar’s Definition of Bi-polar Disorder
Written by Kathryn Moore

You never know the disease that plagues you because it only makes you act like a suicidal asshole in other’s eyes, but really, you are trapped in a prison worse than any man’s hands could ever create: Your own mind, inescapable and no chance of parole. The Bastille is Heaven when compared to the cell in your own head. Remember this forever!

By Kathryn Moore,
Forever Kathryn Moore,
But Never Kathryn Moore,
Or what I want Kathryn Moore to be….

This is how she feels no smooth coat just blatant truth. I hope it helps some of you understand.

Jill,

If you read some of my posts, you know I have been struggling as a supporter. The best thing that can happen is getting him to admit BP, and then finding some meds. My girlfriend takes Lamictal, some xanax, among others. It is not a cure all, but a lot of the terrible syptoms of BP have been greatly reduced. She was never promiscuous behind my back,but she had terrible anger (throwing things, stabbing her arm with a knife), overacting to the smallest issue, saying terrible things to me, acting like she was better than anyone, spending a rediculous amount of money, etc., etc. She is left with anxiety and constant worry, but the really bad syptoms are gone. We are working on the reamining symptoms. Remember, it is not your fault, which took me a long time to realize. If he is truly BP, he NEEDS HELP. It is a terrible disease that cannot be underestimated or taken lightly. I initially left my girlfriend, and it was this traumatic experience that forced her to get help, because her mother took her to the hospital, where she was finally diagnosed. Again, getting them to admit to BP is a huge, necessary step. If he is gone, all you can really do is suggest he gets help. If my girlfriend did not get help, I couldn’t even remain just friend with her. Let me warn you, even with help it is a constant struggle every day dealing with BP. So you can either count your blessings, or if you truly love him, convince him to get help.

Thanks for your help…he is on meds but I guess not the right ones!
I secretly saw his doctor last week. That took a lot of courage! he told me that if my boyfriend did not tell him the truth, then it was very difficult to prescribe the correct medicine. I agree…I just wish that I hasd seen his doctor sooner!
I don’t know what will happen now. I don’t think he will come back this time somehow. He hides behind his mother, who becomes his alibi (which makes everything ok), while I am left in isolation! Which is how I always feel.
I do love my boyfriend but I also know that without him, life would be a lot more simple, less stressful and my heart will mend….what a terrible and destructive illness. You are right Gunzee; it is not our fault but the confidence you lose is incredible and I can’t help feeling like the victim, when really, I am not. He is. It is so hard!
Thanks everyone

Gunzee, I’m new to this blogging stuff, but I’ve followed your comments ever since I started this. When I first read that you were about to give up your faith, I totally understand that. You wait and wait and wait. You do everything you have been counseled to do. But she doesn’t change. Gunzee, if you give up on her, and on yourself, and on the advice of people like Dave who have lived through it, too, and then finally give up on God, What do have left? What are your choices? Are they choices you can life with? Like if you leave her for example. There will be some relief, but will there be remorse because you love her? Do you really want to leave? Only you can truly know within your heart if you are REALLY honest with yourself. You have a life, too, after all.
I am diagnosed as a bi-polar and I have put my husband through some horrendous things. And there have been times when he has wanted to leave. But he loves me, he really does. And I absolutely adore him. When I am in a manic episode I don’t get happy, I get mean, hostile, and fly into a rage that has the potential of being dangerous. He has lost many friends because of me. He has even relocated because he knows it would be best for me. Has he wanted to leave? You bet. But he doesn’t. He always tells me that God gives him what he needs to stay. God tells him that I am His gift to my husband…go figure. What does Bill do? He believes that nothing is impossible with God. What else does he do? He prays and prays and prays because prayer is the open door that God wants to use to come forth to do His works. Is it because he feels God is so close to him? No, but he doesn’t have to see to believe. He knows God is a good God and God never gives up. So he prays for me, keeps loving me, keeps vigilant that I’m doing all I should do to stay stable: meds, exercise, regular good diet, and good sleep, and therapy when needed. His faith in me and in God keeps me plugging away and keeps me believing in myself. I don’t feel worthless any more or like a witch who should be burned at a stake. I don’t know what your girl is like. I only know what I am like: rages, suicide ideations, jealousy, etc. BUT because he is loyal to me, I am taking responsibility for my own well-being and working to stay stable. I do not want to hurt him. And most importantly, I pray, too, constantly. For I know I have THE FATHER I can really brag about who can do anything. So don’t give up your faith in God. Pray and do all you can to draw near to Him. He promises to draw near to you. He loves you. Marni

Thanks, Donna. I was thinking that maybe what I said sounded sappy. If it lifts your faith and spirit, awesome!! And it’s real. Bill and I do believe very strongly that God is for us in every way. One thing I think is really important for a supporter is to try to find out when your BiPo is really in an episode, and when he is actually in the habit of using it as an excuse. Bill started out as an enabler, but as he gained knowledge, and as he watched me, he started to figure this out. As he did, he did what any enabler has to do. He had to stop enabling me. This takes a lot of stress off of the supporter. I would hope that this would encourage all of you supporters who are so incredibly stressed, emotionally drained, and ready to quit, to explore through info. like AlANON, supporters for alcoholics, or info. for co-dependents on how to break that cycle, etc. Enabling is enabling regardless of what the disorder may be that the loved one has. And this, the enabling, is what makes the supporter feel victimized by his bipo loved one. This is survival knowledge for supporters. As a BIPO, I can tell when I really just want to use being Bipolar as an excuse to avoid responsibility or some other thing I want to avoid. Remember, Dave said that the Bipolar person is a person, and the disorder is the disorder and how important it is to separate the two. He also said how the disorder is a manipulator…and it is. And if the bipo sees that it works, that distorted thinking part of him will continue to use it. If your bipo won’t take meds or admit to the disorder, there is nothing you can do except learn how to not be used by setting boundaries. It doesn’t mean you love him less; it just means you refuse to get sick with him. You need to stay in touch with yourself and protect yourself. If you both get into distorted thinking, down goes the ship and in comes the emotional overwhelm. As the bipo, I’m not always happy when Bill doesn’t pandy to my moods, but I respect him for it. And I have to say, when I am not in an episode, we have a fantastic love relationship and we are very best and loyal friends. When I am in an episode he is learning to do damage control keeping me in a safe place so I don’t hurt myself or someone else. He has visited my therapist and my psychiatrist to set up a help network, and to get professional info. about the probabilies of recurring episodes and what the episodes entail. That way he doesn’t cast blame on me for what I simply cannot help. One thing a supporter has to be EXTREMELY AWARE OF is that this disorder is a brain-chemistry problem more than an emotional one. How can one help his messed-up brain chemistry? It’s like a thyroid disease or diabetes. If off of meds there are dire consequences. This is also true for the bipo. So it’s important to see the full picture. He has to work to forgive me sometimes because I cost him a lot, and that’s when the rubber meets the road. That’s when he has to remember that in an episode I am NOT IN CONTROL. But it is also not the “in the right mind” me, and he is learning to separate the two. God Bless. Marni

Marni,
It would be easier to forgive and to separate the two if he took some responsibility and at least get on meds to make it managable if not for him then at least for appreciation of me. Thanks for the help.

Hi Gunzee, I get it, believe me. I had the same kind of questions as do most who are looking at things in a realistic way. It only makes sense. But God gave man free will. Most of what you see, ie kids getting cancer, Your girl sticking a knife into her arm, and many other tragedies are not resultant of God’s hand moving or not moving. Many, many times He tries to warn people in advance of dangerous things they are doing or situations they are putting themselves into, and they don’t listen. It often comes through a deep uneasiness within them that they put aside. Also, if there is good in the world, there is also evil. Good and evil are not just concepts. They are actualities. Not everything in this creation is created, ruled, and destined by the hand of man. God has saved my life more than once. And believe me, HE alone is the only source of that protection. Before rejecting the goodness and the desire to protect of God, consider the works of man: i.e. polluted food sources for example that have proven to be carcinogenic that people have eaten for years and have given their kids, think of the dire effect of second-hand smoke on the children who live in homes where cigarette smoke is a constant hazard; think of the lack of wisdom people use everyday from the time they get out of bed to the time they go bed, so they talk on cell phones in all kinds of traffic and cause accidents; think of our polluted waters; think of the contaminated foods we eat from the sea;etc. Then think of evil: such things as people who serve forces of evil; that is real, and being a realist rejecting such things….well, it doesn’t change reality in general. It just changes your reality. And finally, unbelief blocks God. There are also natural flaws because humans are natural creatures, therefore, abnormalities occur such as messed up brain chemistry, addictive genes, deformities, etc. So many things. God either heals, delivers, or strengthens. and in the case of a faith believer, often receives them into His hands to ease their suffering. So, Gunzee, realism can also embrace God and realize that He can only do what faith and obedience allow Him to do. He will not violate free will, and He does all He can to protect us unless we block that. Your girlfriend is where she is for many reasons that are not caused by God. Seek what those reasons might be…and know that He will help you when you’re ready. And that help may not come in the form you want it or expect it. That is why He is God and we are not. He is infinite, we are finite. He sees the whole picture, we see a tiny part of the picture. I was where you are. I like the fact you are so honest. And, Gunzee, I know that your life with your girlfriend is unrewarding, painful, draining, and it puts such a stain on love, that love can die. So I’m not in any way telling you what to do, to stay or to leave. As I said to you before, your answer is in your heart already. Acknowledge that, and then decide accordingly. You move me in your honesty. Just know, I am for you. Marni

Marni,
His reason was, they weren’t working anyway. Is that a horrible excuse to quit treatment all together or what? When we have a headache, tylenol doesn’t work for everybody! Anyway, thanks again and I try to remind myself not to get sick with him everyday. Continue prayer always.

Tanya, I saw that you and Gunzee and Donna had a lot of dialogue going on, but you haven’t been on lately with your experience and perspective as a Bipolar. I’m a Bipolar also, and I just kind of threw myself into the mix. If I was intrusive, I really apologize. Your steps of management are so good. I second them. Marni

Hi Tanya, The difference I hear in you is that you want to manage your life and the disorder and you keep seeking and trying. In fact your list of steps to take to manage the disorder is so awesome. The people I am describing are the ones I personallly saw and listened to every day all day long for about 8 weeks at a time in three different treatment centers, one of them being a hospital. Once a day we rotated to other groups, and I met some of the most intelligent and wonderful people who were so inspiring. The treatment centers not just for Bipolar Disorder. I was admitted to them for other things that put me into precarious situations from the time I was three, maybe younger. In every center, patients were assigned to groups, we couldn’t choose one, and that meant we all got to know each pretty well. I saw what I saw and heard what I heard, I heard what the leading counselor would say, and who was really interested in listening. What I said is harsh in retrospect, and for that I ask you to forgive me. I’ve been on different meds, too, trying to finds the ones that worked the best, and insurance benefits have definitely kept us out of the poorhouse. Thank God for the financial help we can get from whatever source. For people who truly want help and who listen to those who can help them, be it for disorders, abuse, any kind of history, I have so much admiration . And those who do not, who are players and want to live as victims in order to gain whatever they gain from it, I have little patience. I think I really need to work on that. Any person who read that blog that sounded so judgmental, and it is, and is offended, I am so sorry. I’ll be more considerate in the way I phrase things. The last thing I want is to hurt someone else by my attitude or my words. Again, I am really sorry, Tanya. Marni

Hi Marni,

Don’t worry I guess it is the guilt talking I have been hospitilised too the last time in 2006 I have also been forced to attend crisis centres and I have met lots of different people I just saw how the meds although necessary have left them with poor functioning skills the side effects are terrible. We must live the best way we can and for me I feel I am unable to work as my triggers are easily set off I do not wish to be hospitilised again. I also have emotional instability disorder a type of PTS. On a positive note I am trying to find ways to manage financially from home as I believe this is the only way for me. I have written my first novel and I make doll’s outfits both activities are very theraputic for me. You just have to find something you can do to make YOU happy while battling with the side effects and illness. Love you all. Also to all you supporters. Please leave your BP alone for at least an hour upon waking as this is my worse time due to meds affecting the next day. I have to motivate myself to keep active and feel irritated/drugged upon waking. Other people’s comments do not help me at all. After an hour can deal with the outside world quite well. Love you all 🙂

Hi Gunzee,

Hate to be a skeptic too but have receivied tons of therapy, we are lucky in the UK to have the NHS all free. Have you read my prior blog on coping stategies a lot have found them useful. Sleep is the most important though as you have gathered as well as exercise. I try to go for a walk every day natural endorphines etc. I think you need to find your own coping mechanisms and it sounds like you have that down pretty good. It is a shame that a bipolar supporter cannot experience how these meds make you feel – guess that is why I hate mornings it is like thinking you need to do stuff and not getting past the thinking about it phase, then getting irritated with yourself that you have not done stuff and taking it out on others around you and so the circle goes on. Here’s to you and your partner – hope you make it through to getting more from each other and your relationship love you all:-)

Tanya, I appreciate your acceptance of my apology. And I can say I needed the heads- up. Talking in generalities is never a good idea, so I’m sure you were meant to comment back to me. I know I’m very fortunate that if I have reactions to medications, they aren’t too bad. Once the right meds were found, the trick became to find the right doses so that I didn’t feel so lathargic all day or other side effects. By temperament I am a spontaneous person and the only time I’ve ever been able to follow a routine was when I was working. I’m now retired and I have to say the worst episode I have ever had was within the first year of retirement. Being a night person, I was having a great old time watching late night TV and ended up with day/night reversal. That was the beginning of a really hellish year thereafter. My poor husband went through hell with me and as I’ve shared before it was only his relationship with Christ that gave him what he needed to stick it out with me. Through that relationship he gained enough stability himself to be able to research really deeply all of this, and to talk to my psychiatrist and therapist. He also talked to my therapist for help for himself. What I’ve learned over time and more therapy than I ever care to repeat, is much of what you have shared: regular 8-9 hours of sleep a night, it takes that long to re-energize and for the effects of the night sleeping pills to wear off, right? And that first hour really is a trial. Exercise, my biggest hurdle yet probably is the next most important thing necessary for any disorder for management. I have to work every single day with routine. Thank the Lord my husband is extremely scheduled, and as I follow him along the way, especially at night and go to bed when I should, I have more success. But it is a constant battle for me. I don’t know anything about the light bulbs. I think it is so fantastic that you have completed a novel. Have you submitted if for publication? You sound very gifted in the fine arts area. I wish you tons of success getting a home business off the ground. I thought I would be a Spanish tutor via the internet tutoring programs. I taught English and Spanish in high schools for 18 years. But my husband said to wait on that when we first moved here, because I’m now with my girls and grandkids a lot. Sure enough we spend a lot of time together practically a bit of every day as we’ve always been close. I babysit my 3 grandboys A LOT. But still and all, I need something for me. I know I’ll find it because God doesn’t want me sitting around just focused on my own little world. It’s really helpful to have found this blog. It is so interesting to see the posts of others, both supporters and the ones with the disorder(s)(We usually have more than one, right?). I am learning a lot, and HOPEFULLY, what I’ve shared so far has been helpful to someone out there. Anyway, I really understand the things you share. Glad to have met you because of it. Again, thank you so much for accepting my apology. Marni

Hey, Tanya…Would love to be internet pals. Fun Nonni? Yea, maybe so. I can still get down on the floor and wrestle with my little extroverted 2 yr old. I let him mess with my hair and stuff. I don’t have a lot of boundaries when it comes to play, but it turns to very firm when he gets out of line. I think he likes me. As for the other two, a 14-month old and a 7-month old, oh my gosh, I am a goner. They know their second home is here with me (Nonni) and Papa. Our move from west texas to north texas to be with them has been the answer to years of prayer, because I greatly disliked west Texas, and I longed to be with my kids. One son is about 3 hrs. north of us, and the other 3 hrs. north. My Mum’s here, too. Now about you. Do you have a hubby, kids, a supporter? Do you now live in the UK? I think that’s what I read. My paternal great-grandparent left England on the same boat in the late 1800s and didn’t know each other at that time. Somehow they separately migrated to Colorado, and they finally met and married. Ironic that it took them such a distance from the boat to find each other. Anyway, my roots are English and I long to visit Great Briain. I’m intrigued with Scotland. It’s been a good background for the gothic novels I like to read. Have you used any language systems to learn Spanish? If not, I suggest the Rosetta Stone system. It’s a little pricy but it works, and it has great aids for pronunciation. You have a mike and repeat into it what the native teacher says. The program tells you how you did. So it rates you and gives you chances to improve. It is an amazing system. I’m sure their products are online to check out. I’m hoping to learn Italian through that system. But who am I going to talk to for practice? Well, I can talk to myself as I do talk enough for two people! I’m an introvert, but more social than most. When I feel drained from “being out there” because I do like people, I retreat to home and hide out.. My husband calls it going into my cave. Around that vicinity of the Mediterranean, I would love to see Greece, Israel, Iraq (our son served there for two tours of duty). Italy, France, much more for the architecture and the history than for anything else. I lived in Mexico for awhile as part of a Universty of Arizona exchange program with a school in Guadalajara. Gorgeous place to be, and being young and impressionable, and having the love of my live from there, well, I did NOT want to return to the states. But Thank God I did. Anyway, back off of the rabbit trail, every major language is included in the Rosetta Stone program line, and should be online to check out. I want to use it myself to learn Italian. I love all of the Romance Languages. I truly pray God will answer the publication of your novel with great favor with the powers that be. I’ll be praying accordingly. What’s the story line? I am really interested to know what kind of novel you would write. Please describe it too me. I read way too much as evidenced by bookcases throughout the house filled with my book collection. I have a whole case of them I haven’t even read yet, and I get excited just looking at them knowing that one by one, they’ll get read. The whole library here at home is filled with both fiction and non-fiction. I’m also interested in politics. I can’t believe the ridiculous childish stuff going on between two candidates running from the same party. It’s dismal. Luckily, I belong as a member of the opposing party. I don’t know if you follow such stuff. I am somewhat following the heat in England over the increasing numbers of radical Islamists. Bad news.I’m getting the fuzzy-looking film hovering over the keyboard letters. That’s the Ambien kicking in. Sometime I’ll have to tell you my Ambien/meds/and rage trip. Funny now, but incredibly dumb then and dangerous. Talk about distorted thinking!!! Bueno, que Dios te bendiga mucho and mantengate sano. May God bless you very much and keep you well and whole. Hasta pronto. Marni

Hey Tanya, I went back and read ALL of the comments posted and in doing so I learned the answers which I should have already read to know you have a partner and your Mom and that HE is moving you to Spain. (Why Spain?) I obviously didn’t read all of the comments before. As I posted Donna and Gunzee, I was thinking about you a lot and what you have shared as a BIPO. Thank God there is someone out there who “gets It” because of walking pretty much in the same shoes. It’s a comfort to come here to blog because I seriously will not talk about this to anyone who does not need to know. Having relocated, I haven’t met anyone yet, just been with my family. So far, no therapy. I’m avioding it like the plague because I’m so tired of it. After that incident with my Mom, my husband is watching me like a hawk, kind of intrusive. But it’s good. It keeps me accountable. It’s just annoying because I feel like I’m under a microscope (sp?). That last blog was incredibly long. Sorry about that. It was a lot to read. Sometimes I’m too chatty and sometimes I hardly say a word. Last night was a chatty night. Will keep it shorter. Hope to hear you’re doing well. Marni

Marni,

I appreciate your sentiments for Donna and me. It is a struggle every day, but what keeps me here in the end is that my girlfriend understands that it is a struggle for me, and at least knows what is going to trigger her feeling down. Trying to figure out how to not have the triggers happen is a key, such as drinking, or avoiding people who make her angry or frustrated. She used to go out a lot socially with friends. We did Saturday night, and she had a few drinks, and felt terrible yesterday. Not hungover (she didn’t drink much) but it was enough to cause her to be irritable most of the day, then terribly tired. Feeling “down” like this triggerred the worry, anxiety, and crying once she went to bed. I once again had to talk her down (or up) She told me she loved me very much before she went to bed. She knows having even a few drinks does this, but she is finding it hard to give up her social experience. I dont sit on pins and needles waiting for her to get home because of her outbursts, I now wait on pins and needles to see if she is anxious or down because I know I need to dig deep, and turn it up a notch and try to help her. God forbid I had a bad day, I am not allowed, or there would be trouble.
I am tired of venting, but multiply the last paragraph by 365 days and that is my life.

For Gunzee:
I have found this Blog to be very helpful and therapeutic for me as I have BPD, my daughter has BPD and is currently manic and was just in the Psych ward a couple of weeks ago, And my husband (my daughter’s step-dad) is BPD, as well, but doesn’t want to know anything about it. So I can’t make him understand what he is doing to my daughter sometimes when he gets manic and I am the peace keeper. Talk about a 3-ring circus! David Oliver is the best thing that has ever happened for me: The info he provides every day and this blog where I can vent and none of my BPDs know what I had to say! What a blessing! Use it like I do, a silent Psychiatrist! And I do not have the words to express how thankful I am to David.

Marni,
Thanks. It is hard since I am used to him being a certain way, looking a certain way and of course having money. I think that he is somewhere in the middle the last few weeks. Can someone explain to me this thing about his clothes. He washes them everyday, never folds them, sometimes hang them up and doesn’t iron them. I used to iron them and he came upstairs and got them before I ironed them, like he didn’t want me to iron them and he will even wear them wrinkled. I used to fold them and put them in the drawers in the bedroom, but since he’s been washing them himself, he’ll either leave them in the basket or put them in the cabinets in the bathroom in the basement. Although I try not to take things personal but I feel like he’s telling me that he doesn’t want to be grouped with me, like the basement is shis apartment and I’m not invited so don’t touch his things. I also don’t understand his obsession over basketball, his lack of interest in sex and his lying.

Hi Misty,

I went through many years of hell like you to get the right diagnosis. Even after diagnosis it continued I know how you feel. All I can say is hang in there, it does get better, do anything you can to alleviate even tiny stresses, avoud alcohol/drugs and do what ever you can to get plenty of sleep, even an afternoon nap if possible. I am always here if you need to chat. Take care. I am also BP.

Misty,

If you have read the blogs, you know I am a BP supporter. Like you, my relationship was in big trouble, and I felt the way your husband felt. As a supporter, we also need support. If you really love your husband, you NEED to sit down with him and show him the hundreds of blogs to help him understand what is going on. You also NEED to tell him, on a daily basis, that it is not him, and you love him very much, that you appreciate him etc., etc. The feeling of being unloved is the worst thing as a supporter. The daily focus is 99% on the partner with BP, and that needs to be shifted somewhat if you want to save your relationship, in my humble opinion. Good luck.
Gunzee

Hi Gunzee,
I am having a bad day today. I woke up this morning and it hit me. Because of loving him, I don’t feel loved, because of loving him my daughter and I will not experience a real family, because of loving him I won’t get a second chance at marriage, because of loving him, I will live from paycheck to paycheck not accomplishing anything, because of loving him, my life is one big April fool’s joke that will never go away. Ever had one of these days?

Gunzee,
I know. Honestly, I don’t know what’s in it for me. Thanks for the encouragement though.

Hi, Helen: Just want you to know that our disorder(s) experiences are so similar. I was always diagnosed with clinical/major depression, also. When I was an in-patient in 86, they tacked on sever anxiety and PTSD due to childhood trauma. Now it’s General Anxiety Disorder (bad news because it’s still scary). Even my therapist who looked at my DMR-IV test results didn’t believe I was BD because it only indicated depression. At the time I took it I was DEPRESSED. Go figure. When she saw me go through a HUGE manic episode last year, she totally knew that I had received a correct diagnosis at last from the last psychiatrist I saw. I, too, therefore, was diagnosed later in life. Maybe it’s better though that I didn’t know while I was raising my children. It would have colored everything at that time. I cannot begin to imagine the total despair and anger you must have experienced while those tragedies were occuring in your family. It is overwhelming just to hear about them. How you made peace with God is a miracle, and one I truly praise Him for and am glad with you that you feel better. He was definitely not behind what all happened, the evil one was in my opinion. I hope you feel the great LOVE God has for you every day. Thanks so much for sharing. God BLESS you. Marni

PS, Donna, Basketball could be his “safe” place, the place he can most easily escape to for awhile. You think so? Marni

Hi, Tanya, I’ve been thinking about your upcoming move to Spain. I wanted to share something with you. I lived in my previous city for about 16 years. Among our circle of friends and acquaintances over those years I began to be seen by them as flaky because I would take on responsibilies and then dropped them because the stress would just take me down so badly. I wasn’t yet diagnosed with BD, but they had seen me go through a major bout of depression. Depression is so much more accepted by society. But BD is still loaded with stigma because of the term manic-depressive which is still remembered and used, and because of the great ignorance about the disorder. But you already know all of this. When I became more and more “wierd” they formed different attitudes towards me, especially my pastor who couldn’t run fast enough. The church is incredibly ignorant about mental disorders. Anyway, the thing that has relieved me the very most is everything in my new home is fresh. It’s like a clean slate to write on what I want to. No one knows me here except my family, and I am incredibly much wiser about who I share personal info. with. Now that I’m rightly diagnosed, I can do what you do, following the steps you do, right on, and not trust myself easily to others. The reason I said in one of my previous blogs that I don’t talk to a soul about this is because of the ignorance (which isn’t their fault), misjudgements and my growth in wisdom. I don’t know if you want a clean slate, but it has boosted my heart enormously and in fact, I am much better!!! Before our move, I was rapidly heading into another trip as an inpatient to a hospital. I am no where near that now. Just thought I’d share this with you. My husband actually stumbled upon Dave’s website a long time ago, but I never checked it out until now. Having this place to blog and people who are inside the experience whether a survivor or a supporter is so good for me. Til later, Marni

marni,
He once said that baskeball is keeping him alive. The other day he left out of the house and our daughter asked, “where did he go, something to do with a ball isn’t it”.It is very frustrating to hear him on the phone laughing and talking to his friends about basketball and he has said 2 words to me in 2 days and that’s “I’m gone”

Donna,
I was just reading your last post, and found a similar issue with my girlfriend. She says she wants to do things for herself (such as the wash)and stop relying on me so much. She appears to be very concious of stuff left around; when it comes to my stuff. A pair of shoes on the floor by the bed, and I will hear a comment. However, as I sit here typing, I am looking at her two coats that have been hanging on the railing in our living room for days. Not to mention the two laundry baskets of clean clothes (of hers) that have not been put away yet. Yet she was telling me yesterday that my closet was disorganized. There seems to be a double standard. Just an update- I agreed to let her stop working a current full time client contract, so she can deal with her issues, and get more involved with with the creative aspects of our business, give her more time to sleep, exercise, etc. I hope it works. Of course I laid out some ground rules, so lets see how it goes, and see if she can follow them. She came to the conclusion that it was working at a particular client’s site that was causing her to not be able to focus on getting better, and she was feeling overwhelmed. My fear now is that she will just overwhelm herself with other things instead. Hopefully this isn’t a catch 22.

Gunzee and Tanya, I know about getting easily overwhelmed, but just don’t have an attitude about it. Gunzee, my boyfriend complain about anything. It could’ve happened a day, a week or a year ago but if could complain about me and our daughter he will. I can’t believe that he complains about our daughter’s room who is 9 and the basement looks like trash. He even tried once to pay the bills, but that only lasted 2 weeks max. Now he just gives me the money for the mortgage. I think that he can only focus on one bill. His car insurance has lapsed and he didn’t even get his plates renewed for his car. But he will buy all sorts of basketball books, videos etc. I wish he could just tell me that this is what I am able to do and this is what I am not so I won’t resent you for taking care of them and throw in a few I love you’s too.

Tanya,
You are right, he could improve with effort but that’s just it. He doesn’t put forth the effort if he did he would get on meds and would be in therapy. He knows that it is difficult living with him but instead of doing something about it he just says “this is the way I am and I’m not changing” which again makes me feel that he doesn’t care about us. Yes, he pays the mortgage but there has been times that he has waited to the end of the month and then says that he doesn’t have it because of some stupid financial indecision that he made and they end up taking it. So, I can’t count on it either and ended up taking out loans to cover all the expenses. I just refinanced the house and the payment is lower but all that did was made him resposible for less while I still have the same expenses.

Donna, Just to end the story, I get along well with Bill’s ex, and he gets along really well with mine. Whatever bitterness I had, and fear, decreased over the years until it somehow just disappeared. That doesn’t change what happened, though, and it doesn’t change what I told you I would do. marni

Hi Donna,

Is it possible for you to take in a lodger? to cover the mortgage payment.

Donna,

Hi, I asked the question because I have a friend who I admire a lot. She is a single mum with 2 kids, works in a department store, owns her own home but takes in foreign students, she sleeps on the couch in the living room during the college season, she mostly has chinese students and I know she gets paid quite handsomely and she normally has young girls. She does not mind the college season discomfort because it gives her and her kids financial peace of mind. Love you all:-)

Tanya,
It’s a good thought. I lve in a college town.

Thanks marni for your kind words and yes it seems we do have a lot in common. I thank God for leading me to the Psychiatrist who was wise and experienced enough to see that it was not just depression and found a treatment for me that has kept me fairly stable for the past few years. Thanks to him I have never had to be in a hospital, so far anyways, because I know that everything that is what we are changes with time and I may see that manic episode that lands me in the hospital before my time on this Earth is over but I feel as long as I can keep my appts with my Psych and take my meds as prescribed that the likelihood of this happening is very small, but possible. I feel the love from God and I Pray for my family as well as others on this blog and others in this world who are struggling with life from one reason or another. And I do agree with you very much that God didn’t have anything to do with the traumatic events I have experienced, but yes, indeed the evil one and I praise my Psych for opening my eyes to how I was angry with God. Thank you and God Bless you too. My Prayers for you and all others.

OOPS. Didn’t specify, but the last blog I wrote concerning praying for everyone was in answer to Helen. Marni

Donna,

You know him so well now you can predict his behaviour – his bad behaviour. You must stop bailing him out financially – I know it is normal with couples to help each other out from time to time but you get no gratitude and have ended up with financial problems yourself. Don’t do his laundry it is giving you stress. Can you try to live as if he is not there – I mean do everything you can so you are not at the brunt of his persecution guilt trip. From what you have worded he is so lucky to have you and you deserve love and some sunshine in your life. Or does he make up at times for all the stress. Is he worth it? Do you still love him? Put yourself first for a change it is not a crime, your happiness from that will spill into those close to you. Love you all 🙂

Donna,

I know how you feel. the other day we were both working from home. After lunch I went to give her a kiss and she turned away, saying this is work time. Today we are in the office, and she is complaining that she needs some affection, I am not paying enough attention to her, she wants a hug or a kiss. Go figure. Whatever, whenever she wants, but only when it is convenient for her. She got a tanning bed a few weeks ago, and decided that it was my responsibility to call the electrician to get it installed. I jumped through hoops to get the electric installed, and assemble the bed. I also paid the electrician. That was yesterday. She hasn’t even bothered to look at the bed yet, never mind use it, or even thank me. I secretly wish this new house we are building would fall through and our business would fail so i could not feel guilty leaving. I have had enough, and think it is time for a make or break conversation tonight. I know I keep saying that but she is just so pitiful, and I am worried about her reaction and what she may do. It kills me because I just gave up my apartment last month to move back in with her full time. The thought of finding another apartment and moving again for the third time in 6 months is too much handle.
Very deep catch-22.

Donna,

I hear you. Your comment about you being there for his convenience about sums it up for me and the way I feel. I wonder if she was well if I would be needed as much, or would she even want me around. I think she knows I am not happy, particularly today, so she called and asked if she wanted me to bring home lunch “honey”. She asked me if I has something on my mind, as she could tell by the non-responsive way I have been to her the last 2 days. She is getting lots of hints. 2 nights ago at dinner she wanted a little more pasta. She said she felt bad taking it because she is watching her weight. I responded “go ahead, we all need some joy in our lives.” She took that comment correctly, as it was intended, that if I need to take joy in a little bit of pasta, there is a problem. Hang in there, maybe we can both come up with solutions some how.

Gunzee, marni, Tanya
Get this! He’s leaving me. He doesn’t know if he loves me and he doesn’t desire me and he just wants to live by himself and he doesn’t talk to our daughter because he doesn’t have a relationship with her and him living with me has changed our relationship. Have I been punked or what?

Hi, Donna, Just read your blog about Larry and the rental car. I have to wonder myself…what is it about him that keeps you in this thankless situation? Why do you think you let him to take so much advantage of you? I hate to hear it, and I really hope you can find a way out of it. Still praying for you, Marni

marni and Gunzee,
It seems like it should be a relief but I find myself very angry that I have gone though all of this and he leaves ME? I should have left him a long time ago. Then to know that he had been planning it. So in other words he was just using me. I don’t feel a sense of loss, just used. The things he said were so mean and heartless. I just refinanced my house already. I’m going to have to figure out what I can do.

helen,
he actually thought he could stay here until May 1st. After telling me that he didn’t know if he loved me and he was only having sex with me because it’s what I wanted and not what he wanted. What gets me is how can he say the things he said and this is the same man that needed me to rent him a car last week. I feel like he was just using me all along just to save up money so that he could get him a place. I told him that he needed to make other aarrangements and he took a few things and left but didn’t leave my keys. When I told him that he didn’t leave keys he said he still had box here, which he has more than that and I told him that I needed to be here when he came and got them. I just feel like he didn’t have to be so nasty and this didn’t have to be nasty. I don’t want to ever see him again. Since, he doesn’t have a relationship with our daughter there shouldn’t be any reason that I should have to.

For Donna:
my best advice for you is to stop letting him use you. He apparently will not help himself and I have learned, the hard way that the ones with Bi-polar Disorder, who do not get help, only get worse and will use you until you are all used up. My ex said some awful things to me before my divorce and he got worse after I did divorce him because I married another man and he realized he would have to take care of himself from then on. He was very nasty about that, and still can be 16 years later. Last call from him was at Christmas time ’07, he made me mad enough to yell at him and he informed me that would be the last time that our daughter and I would ever hear from again. Yeah right! If I had a $1 every time I have heard that one! It is really a matter of how long you want to put up with it. Me, I would change the locks and get rid off him because he will never really be any good at all for you and your family until he gets help, which he is apparently not going to do any time soon. Love and Prayers for you and your family. Helen

Hi, Donna, Just a note to say congratulations on changing the locks!!! I agree with everything Helen has said. I’m sure the hurt goes deep as what you’re feeling is called “betrayal”. He took all you had, he asked for more, you found more to gave, and then he turned his back on you. That is betrayal, one of the most difficult emotional states of pain to overcome. BUT you can. Sometimes it takes quite awhile, but for your own well-being, you must refuse to mentally rehearse all the stuff you’ve been through with him. As the thoughts and memories come, you have to just say NO out loud and get your mind on something else or some activity that takes your concentration. It will not happen overnight….and it is a constant battle at first…I can totally testify about that to you. Your mind will constantly want to drift back to different memories which will be catalysts for more anger, more indigantion, and more hurt. So learning to say NO as the memories try to haunt you is like learning a skill…and like any skill, it develops as you practice it. Eventually, the memories will be there, but the STING won’t be. If you allow your life to progress, and try to make your life and your daughter’s with you embrace some fun things, even if you “don’t want to”, it will definitely be healthier for her. She needs healing, too, and I know you hurt for her. You can be a large part of a positive future for her. If there is anywhere that offers counseling on a sliding scale based on income and debts, usually civic provided, I think it would be good for both of you to just get it all out to someone who is trained to help you. I know we are ALL full of advice and sometimes thinking everyone is telling you what to do, especially when you are so hurt, can get really irritating and tiresome. Just know we are first and foremost concerned for you and want to see you healed, and secondly, we are speaking to you out of our own very valid experiences. So try to be patient with all of us, and as you are able, give real consideration to our sharing. I have to ask once again about possibly finding a roommate, or someone who can just rent a room from you. I am glad you are keeping us updated, because I think you can tell, we care. Marni

For Donna:
I know you are experiencing a lot of mixed emotions right now but I am glad you got the locks changed for your own safety and I also know that, with time, your emotions will quit raging and you will have a somewhat normal life, as I do not know if he is the father of your daughter or not. If he is you will have to deal with him periodically but you must stand your ground and do not let the Bi-polar persuade you into more pain, as I have done in the past. Mt ex wanted to leave for a while and I would work extra hours or a 2nd job to get him the money to leave on. Unfortunately, he always came back and I, thinking it was important to have my daughter’s father in her life was the best way to go, let him back in. He opened my eyes when my daughter was about 5 years old. He would not let me into the house I was paying rent for! He brought my daughter to where I worked in a cafe and left her there and told me not to come back! To make a long story short, my daughter is being treated for BPD and she loves her father dearly, but she can only handle him for a couple of weeks or less per visit. So think good thoughts about having made your stand and don’t let him weasel back into your life without getting help and staying with it. Make him prove himself 1st, when he tries to come back, like I am pretty sure you will. My heart and Prayers go out to you especially during this difficult period. Helen

Hi Donna:
The why he doesn’t leave your keys and take his stuff is because he expects to come back to you when it makes him happy to do so. You are a safe haven in his mind, I believe from my experience with my ex, and as long as you will allow it he will keep coming back to you. You may be the only woman he has or ever will love (again my ex) and as long as he can, he will return to you. So you have to be extremely strong when that happens or you will be right back in the same mess he left you in this time. He may use visitation with your daughter as an excuse to be there. My ex sure did and abused it sometimes. I believe you did yourself a favor by shutting down his cell phone, probably saved yourself a ton of money. My heart and Prayers go out for you, as always,
Helen

OK guys,
It’s the weekend and for the first time in I don’t know how long I don’t have to worry what kind of weekend it will be based on his moods. But, it’s almost like I don’t know what to do with myself now so I hope you all will be around to talk.

For Donna:
You will probably experience these emotions for quite a while. Just because you can no longer put up with what he has to give you doesn’t mean that you have stopped loving him. I still love my ex, probably never will stop, although I have been married twice and had one long term relationship (this one died in between my 2 husbands) since I have been divorced from him. Been married for a total of 5 times, 3 divorces, 1 passed away and my current husband as well as the long term relationship. Actually still have feelings for all of them as love will still linger when there is no relationship to continue. Take care and as always my heart and my Prayers go out for you. Helen

For Donna:
You just can’t turn your heart off like a light switch, you have a child and a history of some good times with this man and it will not happen overnight but will get better in time. My way, and I do not advise anybody to take my path, to fill the empty area I felt was to replace it with a new man, new relationship, new everything to occupy my mind and heart. My previous relation we never got married and it ended when he died in May and in October the same year I was getting married again. My Psych told me not to rush into it and should wait at least a year to make any life changing decisions as this, but me being me did it anyway and he is a Bi-polar but he is not so bad as my ex. He never gets violent with me, never threatened me and when he is Manic he moves out of the house for a few days because I think he realizes that his “bad temper” might hurt me. So it’s not perfect but it is close enough most of the time and I am too far gone with Emphysema to go man hunting again. lol Just take it one day at a time that is all you can do. My Heart and Prayers go out for you, as always, Helen

Hello Donna,

You did the right thing changing the locks. Everything has changed for you all those negative emotions you must have felt going to your basement. I guess you feel empty because those negative vibes took a lot of space in your heart. You need to heal yourself, I expect you have a lot of emotional wounds. My advice is just to do all that ME stuff if you can, whatever it takes allow yourself at least an hour a day devoted to you and what you want to do. In time the pain and emptyness will wash away. Your words on this site paint a picture of a kind, caring, sensitive woman struggling in a difficult situation. You might not see it now but love is always around the corner and unexpected, and when painful stuff happens it only makes sense or has a purpose several years on like it all happened for a reason. Bye for now 🙂

Hey, Gunzee, You’ve been on my mind A LOT. Last you posted you had had a pretty bottom-line conversation with your girl. I hope you’re OK. Just wanted you to know I haven’t forgotten you. Hope you’ll let us know how you’re doing. Friends, Marni

Helen,
I really appreciate all of you. In the past I have been in therapy 3 times and medication 2 times over this man. We probably do need it again but my insurance won’t cover it. I need to look into employee assistance or something. I think that it will help us both. You all are a great deal of help. Talking to someone who has been there and done that is more helpful than someone who doesn’t have a clue.

Hi Marni,

It has been a bit tense since my discussion with her. She is very afraid I am leaving her for good. Last night she wanted to know straight out what my plan was, as she wants to know that six months from now i wont be gone, she would rather know now. Well, i gave up my place and moved back in with her, plus we are both financially committed to buying a house, so I told her we would have to see, but i am committed to help her for now. that is the best answer I can give her. We also have a strategy and plan for reducing her workload. So I told her I would hang in however. I also re-iterated that I can’t be negatively affected by her anymore, and I will tell her when she is being a B**** and when I am not happy, and frankly I don’t care about the consequences as I don’t really have anything to lose. She is seeing a new psychiatrist, and luckily he is more than a medicine dispenser. She has been on 200mg of lamictal daily. I told her two weeks ago that I think she was doing better early on, on less medication. He told her last night to cut her dose in half, because she forgot to take her morning dose Sunday, and seemed to feel much better mid day, sort of confirming my observation. We are trying anything at this point, and he also suggested her seratonin levels may be off, but we are going to try the reduced lamicatal first. I am taking this day by day. She says she feels bad and embarrased that she is driving me crazy (and away) and I would like to believe that. But each day is still a new drama. We will see what will happen with reduced meds. If she starts her old ways (nastyness,etc.) I may have no choice. It seems that Donna is having a much harder time right now so I hope she is OK.

Gunzee

Hi, Donna, The unfortunate truth is that there are a lot of jerks out there, and it’s really hard to not compromise b/c of loneliness or finances, or sex. I mean women need “it”, too, not just guys, and often that will be the stumbling block. It’s just so easy to fall into bed and, oops, into the relationship. But there really are some great guys out there. A lot of the ones you will meet will depend on the type of environment you’re in, so choose accordingly. My prayer is that you never sell yourself short, don’t compromise, and go through the lonely times rather than over, under, or around them. The hardest thing to break is going around that same mountain over and over again. Another truth I had to learn was trite BUT true….doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. So hang tough, and know we are all here for you, praying for you, and asking God to give you wisdom, comfort, and to bring wholesome people into your life. Glad you’re staying in touch. Friends, Marni

Hi Marni,

Wow we all have such a lot in common. My father is an alcoholic has been since he was 12 when his father was crushed to death on a building site then his sister 18 died of leukemia I had him move in with me when my mum chucked him out it was really sad, the vomit, the passing out, the local pub landlords would phone me to fetch him after he had passed out but I loved him and he was a happy likeable funny man when sober. When I was expecting my daughter Elisha (meaning gift from god) now 18 I cried every day with depression because the father had left me I was penniless, homeless and thinking what a mess I had made of my life I was surprised to see an angel in shimmering white lights come to me in daytime and show me a baby she held it out to show me saying this was my baby and everything was going to be OK we were going to be ok and not to keep worrying the angel was right. More recently I was expecting again and I went for my 12 week scan and was put in a wheelchair told not to move or walk had a needle in my arm and was rushed tt theatre I had multiple ovarian cysts that burst they said I should have been in agony but I wasn’t any I lost the baby a few weeks after but had a series of dreams telling me my baby was alive in heaven but was sad but I did not name him so in my dream I said his name was Ezra he liked it and was happy and said he loved me it wasn’t his time to be born. Boy did I cry after that. So even though I am not religious there is definately something going on. Love you all 🙂

Wow, Tanya. Life is so tough. Somehow, everyone is at first looking for life to be easy at some point, but tho’ it can be happy, it is never easy. Yours was really painful, so I’m really glad that you have a guy who loves you and a daughter so beautifully named. I’m sorry you lost your other baby, but like you dreamed of him, it wasn’t the time. My oldest daughter had a miscarriage with her first baby, and it was so hard for her and her husband. They had so much joy over her pregnancy. I was praying for her, and like you, it was revealed to me that if she named her little one, it would help her b/c the baby would be a complete one, and she, too, knows that baby is waiting for her. She dreamed of him and it released her a lot. She was a bit fearful when she got pregnant again, but since then, she’s had two healthy baby boys. Both of my daughters had premature babies, tho, which are perfect now. I also have a close friend who had an abortion as a very young women b/c she knew her parents would never accept the fact she got pregnant and wasn’t married. She suffered from guilt and grief for close to 15 yrs. until she “addressed” that baby, asking for forgiveness b/c he never got the chance to become who he could have been here. Then she named him and committed him to God. She finally found peace. She’s had other children since which are a real joy to her. The things you went through with your father are things I can understand but you had it much worse than I did. I am so sorry you had to go through such misery. But you have come a long way from that, and I admire you for it. The angels, the dreams, I totally believe. Religion isn’t really the point. Relationship is and the Lord definitely sent those angels and dream to you b/c of His love for you. Indeed, something is going on…His love. He is doing all He can to redeem that time you lost in unhappiness and turn your life into a much better one with your cooperation. Thank you so much for sharing all of this with me. It does help to know someone is out there who gets the picture and understands to a great degree what you have been through. By the way, I also understand that you often broke up with your guy b/c of your own feeling of being so unworthy of him and that you were causing him pain. The fact that you can now like and accept youself, and can receive his love is awesome. That is a hard place to get to. Many times I still feel like I’m such a Bitch and Burden to Bill. But he says No. He says he learned from Dave Oliver, whose newsletter he reads every day, to separate me from the disorder and that he loves me deeply. I still have a ways to go before I can stop seeing myself as the disorder rather than separate from it, and feeling defective and not wanting new people to know, keeping it a secret, b/c to me it’s still a stigma and to many others as well. However, the really good thing that has come out of it is meeting people with all kinds of disoreders: sycophrenics (sp) who constantly hear voices, obsessive-compulsives, Depressives, BIPOS who find relief through cutting, etc. I’m not afraid of them, but rather have compassion. I hope that by going through all of this, I will be used to give others the acceptance and understanding they need. It has also helped me to know that so much of the disorder is chemically neurological, and also to know how very close The Lord can be to me. This is not his will for me, but He is definitely with me through it. Knowing all who are posting their comments, both the survivors and the supporters, is helping me to accept myself more each day, and I know the Lord sent me here for this very thing. Like Donna says, I am so thankful for you and the others here. It’s really good to hear from you, Tanya. Again, thank you. Marni

Hi Donna:
If you live in the USA where people would go in your area to apply for food stamps, Medicaid, or cash assistance there is usually a mental health counselor available either for free or for very little money. I have never used this type of assistance but it may be helpful for you and your daughter. Just an idea that I am aware of in the US. Good luck and my Prayers for you as always. Your friend, Helen

Marni,
I like that!!! It’s funny how I can laugh about it because it is insanity. Thanks for all the help. Gunzee,
I feel like I have desserted you. We were the supporters. Now I am not. I am not saying for youu to leave her, I just hope that she can somehow find a way to stablize and realize what a good mand she really has. But as others have said, You can’t save her but you can save yourself.
Friends always,
Donna

Helen,
Let me clarify. There are local mental health centers that serve people on medicaid, private insurance or private pay. I don’t qualify for the sliding scale fee due to income but I can’t afford private pay either. I have a high deductible plan health insurance, so bascially i have to meet the deductible befor they will pay anything. If you find something different, please let me know. Thanks.

Gunzee, I was rereading your post to me from earlier and I realized I didn’t really make clear why the antianxiety meds were needed for me. Maybe you already gathered why. But specifically you said your girl focuses on insignificant things, complaines, and worries all of the time. And that she can’t work. The General Anxiety Disorder I have is actually more difficult for me to deal with than the Bipolar. The thing you mentioned that jumped out at me this time was her focus on “insignificant things”. I get stuck in FIXATED thinking. Sometimes it takes days for me to get off of it. I get stuck on an issue and go ’round and ’round and ’round the mulberry bush. I get all worked up over it and it often leads to delusional thinking until the fixation gets broken, hence the meds. Unnatural worry is usually a result of anxiety, too. The wierd thing about generalized anxiety is that there is usually no cause to worry, nothing that would lead to worry….it just comes out of the blue, exaggerated and compulsive. It can be mild or really awful. Anyway, I don’t know if your girl actually fixates on something and can’t get off of it or not. If she does, an antianxiety medication would probably help her a lot. As far as complaining, I’ve just reached the point with people who keep complaining, especially about the same thing over and over of saying, “I’m sorry you feel that way.” Then I get on with my life. I know there’s no way I can make them happy if they’re determined to be unhappy. I used to take it so personally and feel like gee, I really need to do something about this. Even if I couldn’t do anything, I’d try to defend myself. It just used up a lot of air. If I need to change something b/c the complaint is valid, than I need to change it. But if the complaining is just from a negative attitude, I’m not mean personally, I just don’t buy into it, and thus my answer: “I’m sorry you feel that way.” It’s really hard not to take the bait and try to defend myself, but if I can keep the presence of mind to just answer as I have said above, it somehow just releases me and I can get on with things without being all flustered and frustrated. Actually, it usually leaves the other person flustered and frustrated 🙂 Til later, Friends, Marni

For Donna:
I was just thinking and wondering have you ever considered checking into bankruptcy as it seems you have so many bills. Probably you can call legal aid and they can refer you to an attorney that will not charge for the consultation to see what your options. I do know what the laws are where you live but I allowed my ex back in my life for about a year and of course, coming up with money for daycare and for him to leave on left me highly in debt so I filed for bankruptcy in 1995. I had the option of keeping my home, a primary car and so on but got rid of credit card debt and other debt that included some things that were collateral, but I let everything go because i was paying way too much for a mobile home that I let him talk me into buying and the car he promised to do the maintenance on was falling apart. So I kept a few things to keep paying for and was in a much better situation financially afterward and so much more relaxed knowing I could easily support my daughter and myself. Just a thought, but you might want to check it out. Helen

Yes Donna I have to agree with Marni:
In my opinion this is the best support group available (and definitely the largest) for anyone who has had to support, still supporting someone with BPD, or has Bi-polar Disorder themselves. I have found this blog to be very therapeutic and all the support from the ones here who care about us all and Pray for us and/or offer advice from their perspective has kept me from going off the deep end more than once. Even if we can manage to get you and your daughter some counseling, which I am sure we can somehow, I would miss you so very much if you leave this blog. your friend, Helen

P.S. Same goes for the rest of you, and you know how I am talking about!

For Nightlady:
I know you are out of the loop for the time being so all I can do is Pray that you have peace and happiness, that your boyfriend is fairly stable and treating you well. And the menopause isn’t driving you nuts. lol Helen

Hi Friends,
i am here for all of you. Eventhough though I feel like I didn’t win the battle, i am here to offer any support to you in hopes that you might win. I have been trying not to beat myself up over it but I have good days and bad. Please keep in touch.

Donna,

Yes, the complaining is overwhelming; nothing is good enough. Funny this came up. I just brought a brand new, very expensive bed to the house from my apartment, as well as expensive 1000 count sheets. I almost didn’t because I was very hestitant as she had nothing to do with the purchase, is was for me when we were broken up, and I knew deep down she would have an issue with it. The bed is awesome, but I have heard nothing but complaints for a week now, about how her back is killing her, how the padding isn’t smooth on one side, the sheets don’t fit,the sheets are white and don’t match with any of her compforters, etc. etc. I mean every day. So I just told her today after another bitch session about it as she was changing the sheets, fine, we will put it in storage and use your 15 year old stained, concave bed that hurts my back. Then I get that I am being too sensitive and respond in a knee jerk way, after a week of incessant complaining about it. Funny, she reduced her dose of lamictal by half about a week ago. She says that I get too defensive, but she has an answer for anything I get upset about, or she thinks my reaction isn’t warranted after a week of complaining about the same thing. Ugh, I myself am tired of complaining to you every week. I feel bad for her, but I am almost convinced that she isn’t worth any of the grief at this point. She can find someone else to help her.
Sorry for the constant venting.

Gunzee,
Please don’t apologize for venting, and especially to me. i know I have done my share. If you change the bed and or the sheets, the complaining won’t stop. she’ll just complain about something else. I wish I knew why they did that. Have you gone to counseling with her?

Tanya,
What’s with this bed thing, is this a common theme? At first Larry said that he slept on the couch because it was better for his back, then he said because I have the ceiling fan on, not to mention that befor we moved into this house, I didn’t have ceiling fans and he slept in the bed, is this just an excuse to withdraw?

Hello again Donna,

Sorry I lost track before. The couch, the fans, sleeping in the bed and then not does not add up to me. I think his issue must have been about something else. He acted irrationally you do that when you are quite unwell I covered up my tv and refused to let anyone switch it on. I can’t for the life of me provide an explanation. The sad fact is he chose to keep his thoughts to himself. It has taken me 20 years of having BP to be able to share with my nearest and dearest the strange dark casm of my mind. I confessed all to everyone I told my mum I thought she was trying to kill me I told my partner what I thought he really meant when he spoke to me. The sad part is it took years to accept my thoughts/rational as unreal it is my illness and I keep telling myself he loves me, she loves me despite what the devil in my head keeps saying. Inside your ex’s head is a horrible place he has no control over. Be strong in yourself you probably gave him the best of times in his life and I know what kind of saint that takes. So a big cyber hug from me.

Hi,Gunzee, Just a quick response. Did SHE cut back on the Lamictal, did the doctor talk with her and agree to it, did you suggest she should do it? I cannot stress enough the vital importance of staying on the medications and have them monitored and changed only with medical approval. It takes time to find the right meds and the right doses, but the worst thing the survivor or the supporter can do is fight the idea of meds, or mess around with the dosages by themselves apart from a medical doctor. It helps to get second opinions of you don’t have complete confidence in your doctor. If she is on the right medical regime, I think you’ll find the strife will decreaase a lot. Your friend, Marni PS…a new bed with 1000 count sheets sounds soooo yummy. Definitely check her meds.!!!!!

Hi back, Tanya. Your shared personal experiences and advice from years of learning are really meaningful. Today was a real bummer for me, and really I know you’ll get it. I have been feeling so well and so stable, and my energy level high, my thinking has been good…all has been great. So I started taking on a little more “stuff”. In the past, I was a really strong person, I was a high-achiever if I was involved in something I really believed in, and I was active. At home alone when I was raising my kids, I had to fight depression, but I managed to until it got to be too much. My ex-husband, whom I’ve forgiven and been forgiven by thank God, at that time completely tore me down and never for a moment thought I was anything but selfish and lazy b/c I was committed to being at home with the children to watch over them. He never believed I was ill. You may remember I ended up in the hospital for 6 weeks. Anyway, since then I feel like I have become so weak. I did manage to finish up a teaching career, but barely. The last two years were hell, and it was grace that got me to the end. I had already started the worst manic episode of my life and all told it lasted about a year. Now we’ve moved, I’m retired, Bill’s retired, we’re with our kids and grandkids, and we’re making it financially. So all is great, right? Well, in the US, I don’t know how it is in Britain, we are “supposed” to be multi-taskers, high producers, able to cover bases at work, home, church, etc. and still be happy, right? Also youth and beauty are prized, so there’s a really highly artificial standard of what a successful person is. Then, too, just as the kind of person I am, I want to be involved in helping people and taking some classes and so on, and I started to commit to a few things. Soon I had to tell my kids I had to not babysit for two or three days during the week. I started looking around the house at papers piled up that needed filing, a ton of photos piled around to go into albums for my family, at dust and dirt on the floors, bookkeeping tasks I’ve not been able to keep up iwth for two months, and for two days, I’ve kind of been walking around in a daze. This afternoon after a day of complete lack of focus and just revving the engine going nowhere, I started feeling really sick. Panic started coming up and the feeling of being completely overwhelmed by even the smallest of things flooded over me. Normally I try to get through it alone, but Bill was home and I felt I needed to just put the stupid pride aside, so I went into his office and asked him to lay down on the bed with me. He got it immediately and laid down and put his arms around me and said “are you under attack?” (The disorder being a separate thing). I said yes, and then explained how deeply conflicted I felt. Things I used to find so easy or at least felt strong enough to do, now seem so very hard. I told him that when I can’t do such simple things as commit to an exercise class a couple of times a week, or a Bible study one day a week, or maybe voluteer a day, I go ballistic into total, what? I feel like the gears get stuck, and I can’t go forward or backward. I’m stuck and I can’t think clearly. I told him that when I have to realize that what I can now do seems so little, and that when I have to just basically stay in a quiet life just focusing on my home and my kids, I feel lazy and like I’m not doing anything out there to make a difference. I always want to. I wanted so much to volunteer at a Crisis Pregnancy Center, and Bill kind of told me he wasn’t sure I could put that much energy out there. He knows I really, really love to help people in these kinds of problematic situations. And to not be able to just makes me so frustrated and feel so useless. He is always involved in the worship ministry of whatever church we’re attending and I used to always be on the prayer team or teaching…now it’s all I can do to just be there in a pew. He told me that I have gone through about four major episodes that have been bad since he’s known me, that I went through menopause which really screws up your hormones, and that over all of the years of stuffing the “illness” while I was studying, married, childrearing, and teaching, I was depleted. The psychiatrist who first tested me before I was hospitalized a number of years ago, just looked at me and said she didn’t know how I had lasted so long because the people who test like I did usually would have been hospitalized at least two years prior to when I was. She said she didn’t know what I had been running on, but that it was time to let go. I said I’d been running by God’s grace, but I guessed now He wanted me in a safe place for awhile. Anyway, do you ever feel weak and like you just aren’t able to contribute to life as much as you used to or would like to? Do you ever feel like maybe you’re just being lazy? Is it hard for you to just accept that you are not able to do a lot of what society expects of you? Bill tells me that one of the things he loves most about me is my passionate nature, and I say yeah but it’s pretty hard to be passionate when you have to be in four walls all day until some stability comes, and even then to have to do so much less than I desire to. He says it may seem like I don’t do much but that I invest mysel in him, in my family, in my friendships (which are now long-distance), and in prayer. That I invest passion and love in God. And I say yes, but it just is so hard to have to admit that taking on regular commitments or responsibilities just plain makes me sick…there’s no other way to say it. Because of days like today with Bill, I can feel maybe just doing all I can do in my small world where I CAN function is acceptable. I think I remember you saying that you were not able to work because of being Bipolar. Have I got that right? Do you ever feel like I do, that somehow I’m weak and should just be able to do more and handle more than I am right now? One thing I’m really glad for is that you and your guy have come so far together, so well. That you have hung in there proving that love is worth it. It sounds like you have found a really great guy. Friends, Marni

Sorry Marni Have been thinking more about what you have written. I also stayed at home with my daughter out of principal I did not want her with stangers while I worked. I wanted her to have a meal when she got home from school with me every night and yes I felt like an outsider for doing that. The comments “She does not work you know” my lovely chld really pulled at my heart since she was born. I went back to work full time when she was 8. She had her own key it was awful for me but she said “It’s OK mum all adults work, I understand” I think stay at home mums should be praised not shunned. It is only a mother than can provide all the love a child needs not a baby minder. As you can tell I get a bit on one about certain things. Do you hate watching the news? Does all the sad stories seem to affect you more than other people? I can’t watch the news otherwise I cry for days on end. I think we have been given enheightened emotions and feel things more powerfully than others. Sometimes I cry because I am so very happy like when I hear a beautiful song or see a rainbow. One time I laid awake 3 nights on the trot just crying because I was so happy go figure. We are taught to mask our emotions that is why in the workplace if you cry all the time people can’t relate to you you are considered weird and yet I am the same as everybody else just been given more emotions. Do you feel like this? Take Care Tanya

Thanks so much, Tanya. I knew you would get it. I feel so very much better. I have a neighbor couple in their 80s next door on one side and they don’t get out much so I visit them every so often and they are so glad for it. Their home is so beautiful with the kinds of things I think you would really love. Things from the 1930s, 40s and 50s. Old World Charm things. Then across the street is a single mom in her forties who lost her husband two summers ago unexpectedly of an aggressive cancer. We’ve socialized some and I watch her home and stuff. But I really want to get to know her better. She is so interesting. On the other side of me a new family moved in on Christmas Eve. Her husband met her when he was stationed in El Paso, Tx. She is from Juarez, right across the border in Mexico. I lived in El Paso for 16 years and Bill, an Army brat, ended up spending his life there from about the age of 13 years old. That is where we met. I always hated El Paso and am thankful to finally be out of there, BUT I think it’s very “odd” that they now live next door and I speak Spanish. She speaks very little English. Bill and her husband Russ are so much alike. So I guess if you just look out your front door there are enough people to befriend and try to be there for. Right? Domestic violence would be way out of my league, but I sure understand your heart is to be active against it, even if you can’t actually act on that. I shy away from committing too much to my neighbors oddly enough even though I’ve shared what I’ve shared because talk about commitments! At a Crisis Center or wherever, you can be helping someone, but you can then go home and find refuge in your own turf. So I’m praying for lots of wisdom even as I know it will be good to be friends to those I’ve mentioned. I like to keep my home a refuge and am pretty private in that regard. So we’ll see how I can manage this. I was on the brink of hospitalization just before we left El Paso, and it was so scary to be so out of control and to pretty well know it, but not be able to control it. I mean I was OUT THERE!! Example: Bill and I had fought over something I was insisting he do which I had no right to insist on…retire early b/c I was jealous of the people he worked with and spent so much time with. My reality was delusional I’ve since learned but at the time it was what I really felt and believed, I was sure one of the women was also out to seduce Bill. It was pretty late, and my emotions were so out of control. I took my meds including Ambien to try to just escape through sleep. But I couldn’t sleep, I was too angry. I got up, got dressed in some levis, stopped by Bill’s office door and screamed OK, SO JUST DO WHAT YOU WANT…YOU’RE ALWAYS RIGHT ANYWAY, RIGHT? and ran out the door. He tried to stop me but I was in the car and on my way. I guess it was about 10:00 or 11:00 pm. I had forgotten I had taken my meds. I headed out over a mountain pass that separates El Paso into two main parts. As I headed up the pass, I started feeling funny and remembered I had taken Ambien and that was the last rational thought I had. I knew I had to fix my eyes on the white lane markers, period. To make a long story short, I ended up on some dirt road in corn fields way the heck out of the city on the East side with a flat tire. We lived completely on the West side of the city. It was over an hours drive on a normal day. I didn’t run off of the road, didn’t hurt anyone else, and wasn’t pulled over by a cop and issued a ticket being taken in for Under The Influence. Going over the pass, I didn’t run off the cliffs. I had OnStar and had the presence of mind to call in when I got stopped by the flat tire. If I hadn’t have gotten the flat I don’t know where I would have ended up. They managed to contact Bill and by his cell phone tried to direct him to me. He had been looking for me on his own for about two hours when he got the OnStar call. It took them four hours to get him into the right vicenity, but they couldn’t get him once he was on the dirt road. He just somehow found me. Once he got me home, he just started crying and hugging me, saying he thought he had lost me forever. He was so afraid I’d killed myself in the car. That is only ONE example of how far out I was. Moving here is the one and only thing we could do to set me on a healing course. My poor Bill. But here, we are both so much happier and I’m not delusional. I truly believe that God sent his angels to protect me and to keep me from hurting anyone else. The only thingI do remember doing is fixing my eyes constantly on the white lane markers and praying. So you’re right. It’s better to be wise about what you can and can’t do. It is so odd how you can be that person during episodes, and function pretty normally otherwise. Yes, I do know some of the signs, and I know routine is important. I have a very difficult time with routine. VERY difficult. I especially forget to eat. Changing topics, You mentioned you had written a novel. That really intrigues me. How did you come by the desire, find the approach to it, and come up with the story line? How long did it take you? Is it related in any way to the BD, either as a background of the novel, or as a type of therapy for you? The reason I’m asking is b/c on every test I’ve ever taken for career matches over the years, I score pretty equally for counselor, teacher, creative writer or journalist. I’ve done the teacher thing, tend to put my two cents in regarding other peoples’ stuff even if not asked for, and now I’ve been thinking for a long time about writing. Most of all, it’s something that I can do at home, with flexibility, and I am much better on paper than with words. Also people fascinate me and I’ve done lots of study over the years on psychology, temperaments, etc. and I have always loved to read myself. I’ve started a few times, but always end up bogged down and hitting a wall, like “what the heck are you doing? You have no idea of how to write such a thing”. How did you do it and did it help you (therapuetically) to do it? I really would love to hear what you have to say about this. Again, Tanya, I can’t thank you enough for your empathy and your encouragement. It means so much to me I can’t begin to tell you. You’re a very dear and caring person, and I’m glad we’ve “met”. Friends, Marni

Hi, Gunzee, I know it’s scary to think of the commitments you’re making with your girlfriend, but I think that maybe as you read some of our posts who are BD, you will see she is not as bad as she could be. I hope you’ll hang in there with her. Try to find out as much as you can about your part of this BD stuff, b/c that knowledge is what enabled Tanya’s guy and my Bill to stick with us. It has given them some coping skills and has managed to keep their love alive for us. Still and all, though, Gunzee, we really know how hard this is on you, and whatever you decide to do now or later, we’ll support you. Friends, Marni

Hi, Donna, If you read the posts between me and Tanya and our commitment to be at-home Moms, I don’t want you to feel for one minute any condemnation, or criticisim, or that we think we’re better Moms b/c of it. You and many, many other women are in a position of not being able to be home, period. So many I have met grieve over it, but have no choice. Others I have met say they would go insane if they didn’t work, too. Every Mom has her own path to walk. I was blessed in my own mind that I could stay home and form the kind of relationships with my children I never thought I had with my own parents and I felt very hurt by that. I didn’t feel neglected, just unimportant. I also was abused by someone other than themand wasn’t protected, so I felt even more strongly that I needed to be home for my own peace of mind and to feel like I was protecting my children. I love pregnancy, birthing them, going through those first months and years with them, playing with them especially, watching them mature, and then getting scared out of my wits because we lived across the border from the largest border city ever, and a DANGEROUS one where drug lords were all over the place, and El Paso teens were crossing the border every night to go clubbing and drinking. To see them now having successfully survived all of that going down in the gutters and managing to come back up is a miracle to me. I mean I fasted, I cried, I laid out on the floor praying and beseeching God, keeping the Truth of His Word before Him, reminding Him these children were dedicated to Him, and I was looking to Him to keep them and deliver them….and YES! He has. My middle daughter was going to some very ritzy drug parties in Dallas thrown by rich Mideasterners who dealt in oil, guns and drugs. She is now safe, sane, completely commited to God, and is a fantastic Mom. The guy she met in the scene in Austin, Tx who doesn’t want to change so far has given her cause for divorce. she is a truly beautiful girl, black hair, blue eyes, Elizabeth Taylor kind of beauty and she is a lyric soprano. She was training get her Bachelors in Vocal Performance, usually leading to opera. She was nearly killed in a horrible car accident in El Paso and ended with PTSD. It impeded her enough with such panic attacks that she couldn’t drive between austin, tx a short way down the road to her university, SWT. So she had to take a medical leave. BUT God completely rehabilitated her and called her back to her Christian roots, and has given her a baby boy who looks just like her baby pictures. She now has a great head on her shoulders. Both of my girls do. My son is almost there. He is finally leaving Austin to go on a volunteer program in Argentina where he will learn fluent Spanish which he already speaks to a small degree. Now that I live near them and they have seen more the toll the BD takes on Bill and me they have become major supporters and dare I say, caretakers. It is so moving to me to see them mature, beautiful, wise, cheerful, playful girls who sit and talk and nurse their babies together. I can look at them and say “Father God, Thank you so much for keeping THEM happy all through life and safe during the dangerous trials of their youth. I also had friends that had to work and were amazing women to me b/c they were raising really great, responsible kids. In these situations, the parents worked together really well as a team to bring up their children and had very confident children even with two working parents. So there you have it. Your concern for leaving Serenity home is a big one I would have too, yet the money would sure be a help. I would, me being me, give it to my Father God and just tell Him, “Father I am afraid of what could happen to my girl. You know how vulnerable she could be. What would you have me do? Just wait then. He knows how He can best reach you. Just trust Him to show you the “strategy” He wants you to use to fulfill your needs and to keep Serenity safe, too. He can speak through someone unexpectedly on the radio or TV. or Through a book you’re reading, a person who is talking, through ideas that come into your head that bring an ah-ha to them with peace in your heart. In any circumstance if you do not have a feeling of well-being and peace in your heart, wait some more, Unlike us, God is never in a hurry, GRRRR. He has had to teach me alot about the art of waiting and not just waiting but waiting patiently. I think we’re on about the 20th year of working on this together b/c I just can’t seem to nail down patience. I’m not yet where I should be, but Thank God, I’m not where I used to be. God’s grace is new every morning, and every morning we get a new start. How wonderful is that. How wonderful a God who would give us such a gift through His Son. I have you on my heart and mind daily, Donna. Friends, Marni
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Hi Marni,

Since you have asked about my novel here goes, 2 years ago instead of my usual night terrors I had very specific dreams that told me to write this story. Through my dreams I learnt a lot of things that through research turned out to be fact. It is about an ancient God called Dadhyanka and his return to earth. He is the hindu god of destruction and regeneration modern name Shiva. My story has taken 2 years to write and still needs a degree of polishing which I will do when I move to Spain. It did help me because I was being shouted at during the day, told off in my sleep and the voices, bad dreams subsided when I started to write. Out of the madness became something good and I feel very proud I have actually accomplished something in my life. At present it is 45,000 words and the story is told but for modern agents I need at least 60,000 so I hope I will get that with the polishing and extra effort when I move.

I love how you visit your elderly neighbours they are always the forgotten generation but have so much to offer in terms of wisdom/knowledge. Your life appears to be very rich in terms of meeting people. The elderly sometimes seem to be less superficial and very tolerant more relaxed I also get on much better with much older people always have done.

My heart kind of leapt when you shared the jealousy story about your husband’s work place. Why are we so insecure? It is these acts that I know can be so damaging to a relationship. Your husband’s tears could have been my partner’s tears I have caused them too. I really don’t wish to cause another person to suffer because of my hang ups but like you say it is difficult.

Thank you for sharing and my wishes remain focused that we all stay well.

Any comments I have made concerning the bed problem please take with a pinch of salt, at times my foot is in my mouth. I don’t always think ahead with the required level of sensitivity for others feelings. I am trying to address/make amends/ be aware of and change if possible.

Thank you Marni
Hasta Pronto (is that right?)

Oh Marni thank you so much for your kind words, it means a lot to me.

Hopefully you will also find a release from writing.

Before the dreams I had no obvious interest in Hinduism. We will be moving to Nth Spain, Costa Blanca and sadly my daughter will not come with us, she is 18 and wants to stay in our UK home, she says she loves the UK and will never want to move. Thankfully she wants to spend her holidays with us.

You seem to be having a similar battle to me with the insecurity issue and we both are aware and fight it, knowing its release would really hurt our partners feelings. I really dislike that part of me and I make the same choices as you.
What is Ambien like? I have not heard of that one. ALso the meds Lamictal comes up a lot. Is that a good one? Does anyone take Seroquel? I take that and it really works for my anxiety but boy do I sleep loads on it bed at 12 wake up at 12 zombie until 2pm. No wonder I don’t work full time but the meds stop me worrying about the guilt of not working so much. Is there a good med without weight gain?

I must stop rabbiting on am such a bore at times. So good to message with you. All the best. Take care. Tanya 🙂

Hello again Marni, You are becoming part of my morning routine to look at the blog I quite like it – thank you.

The drug you mention that is not a weight gain and does not affect sex drive is something I will look into. I am like you and am thankfully going through a good phase of sleeping but at times the meds just don’t work. Seroquel is brill I can drive, meet my family without the usual panio attacks, bad thoughts or anxiety it has taken forever to get there. I have borderline personality disorder/PTSD as well as BP. Everyone on this site had had very difficult times its no wonder we struggle.

I would like to say a big hello to Helen, Donna and Gunzee hope to hear back from you all soon. That feeling I get from not being alone with this is so good for me and my family. It takes a huge weight from me and them. They are no longer my primary outlet.

Bye for now. Tanya 🙂

Marni,

Thanks for the kind words, thoughts, and support. It is nice to know people (our blog group at least) can appreciate what I am dealing with. Nobody on “the outside” can really know. Things are really bad for me right now, so any inspiration is appreciated. I hope we will all find the answers one day. Thanks for listening to my issues.

Your friend, Gunzee

Hi guys:
I saw someone mention “night terrors” and I wanted to say that I take enough Seroquel so I do not remember any of my dreams anymore but I experience what is called “night terrors” nearly every night and it is terrible. I typically wake up around 2-3 AM and am covered in sweat with an awful feeling in the pit of stomach. Sometimes it is so bad that I can’t go back to sleep. Before I started taking Seroquel I would have dreams and nightmares that I could remember and about 95% of my dreams came true so I have lost that edge now and have no idea what is going on in my sleep. But the “night terrors” are very scary.

Hello Helen,

It was me that posted about having night terrors. I have had them for as long as I can remember. I also take Seroquel for about 2 months now and I still have bad dreams but sleep a lot better – too much really. I was on Lithium for years no help at all.

How long have you been on Seroquel? Like you a lot of my dreams have come true. Do you sometimes wake up after being shouted at to write stuff down? I get random numbers that make no sense they are not lottery numbers. Recently I dreamt that my Aunt was stabbed to death in her bedroom. I have never been to her new house. I described the room to my mum the mirrored wardrobes the bed etc she has been to her house and said I described the room exactly. She says to keep quiet about the dream but I feel terrible it was so real. I am rarely in my dreams I just watch stuff happening in colour so real. I read somewhere it is rare to dream in colour. It is a curse for me I can prove numerous dreams have come true that is why I wrote my book it was given to me in dreams.

Feeling petrified is something people cannot relate to but I can. Sometimes I am too frightened to go back to sleep because I normally enter back into the same nightmare. The best dream I had was three dreams each lasting 3 hours for one night my dream guides told me I was in danger and they were very worried about me. The next dream was a meeting to discuss how to protect me. They reminded of a locket I have in my jewellery box I have had it since I was 8 never worn it as broken they said they could perform protection magic on it and that I should have it repaired the next day they would perform a ritual and as long as I kept the locket on it would be a protection talisman. I have never taken it off, strangely after all the bad stuff that had happened to me in the past nothing bad has happened since wearing the locket. So yes although I do not have the same faith as Marni there is a higher power I do believe in that.

I can offer no advice to help with the nightmares only to say you are not alone and I share your pain. I have tried a lot of meds and Seroquel is the only one to offer some relief. Another thing I do sounds daft but I have a chair by my bed which I sit in before getting into bed. I try to relax close my eyes and meditate letting all thoughts concerns disappear. I imagine my toes sinking into sand or mud and I pray for peace, serenity and protection from my sleep world. I imagine sunshine on my face, wind in my hair and guidance, inner strength to stay well and calm. I only do this when I am going through a bad patch with dreams it does help.

Hello and hugs to Marni, Donna and Gunzee.

Hi Tanya:
I have been taking Seroquel for about 7 years now. One thing I want to add about Seroquel, and this might not pertain to anyone else or you all may already know this, but Seroquel can cause you to loose Potassium. When I was at 600MG at night my legs kicked and jerked so badly that I couldn’t until I got up and walked until my legs would quit and let me sleep. I have found that the most I can take is 300-400MG and that is where I am now. The problem is I can’t remember my dreams/nightmare. I have always had a capability of things coming to me that were going to happen soon, both good and bad, and awake and asleep. I could, more or less, predict the future fairly accurate. Before I started taking such high doses of Seroquel I made a prediction about my daughter and a guy she dated occasionally that they were either going to be living together or married by the time they are 25 y/o. He is in the Army right now, stationed in Korea and it has been over 3 years since they have seen each other. He found her on My Space and they are making to get back together when he is out of the Army in less than 4 years and they will both be 25. But I have lost that capability within the last couple years. The main thing is how much Seroquel do you take and will that amount be increased? My daughter still has nightmares sometimes that she remembers but she hasn’t been on this dosage (400MG) very long and I think that as time goes by she will loose the memory and just have the night terrors, just as I suspect you will too but you have to remember that there are always a certain % in everything that does follow the mainstream. We are all different, have different opinions (I used to be senior management in a market research co), different in many ways, yet the same in many ways too. I suspect that the Seroquel make be causing some of your nightmares but like I said I believe that soon you will not be able to remember your dreams and I will Pray for you to not have to suffer the “night terrors”. I have never had the urge or felt like I was being told to write anything down, mostly I wanted to forget the bad ones and did for the most part and when the bad ones came there was always “the just as I saw it slap in the face”. I am so happy that you can actually meditate. That would never work for me because nobody in my house knows anything important except where the mop, broom, cooking stuff, ect. as I am no longer capable of doing these small tasks, so I get asked a lot of questions before I go to bed. But that is my fault too because the things they don’t know are my small donation to running a home, financial stuff about our accounts I keep up with online. I am going to go for now. I hope I have been of some help for you. Your friend, Helen

Hi Marni:
Your last blog you wrote here touched my heart so much that I couldn’t respond right away. We have so much in common that it is unreal, starting with my uncle molesting (raping) me at about age 14. Except I wasn’t a late bloomer something about what my uncle did and continued to do every time there was an opportunity snapped something in me and I became a predator before I was old enough to realize what I was doing. When Mini Skirts were the rage I was the 1st in my school to wear one and if my skirt wasn’t short enough I would wear a long top and roll it up to the length I wanted. My Dad went crazy on me about the way I dressed because he didn’t know what had happened to me and he lived in fear I would get raped. I couldn’t tell anyone my “secret” because he was my maternal Grandmother’s youngest son and I loved her so much that I knew if it came out it would hurt her so bad that I just couldn’t tell so I endured years of his abuse. I was my Grandmother’s oldest grandchild and she really loved me as much as I did her. She passed away at 56 of a massive heart attack and I was only 18 and I still miss her. I do not complain about my emphysema because I did this to myself. My mother dies at age 45 of pneumonia caused by emphysema and my dad died several years later from lung cancer so I guess you could the odds of a major illness from smoking was definitely very high but I decided to keep smoking all by myself. My 54 years on this has been quite a trip and something I have considered writing a book about but nobody would believe it is the truth and since my life is not fiction I would not be able to write it as so. I am pretty much an open book, anyone can ask my anything and I will give an honest answer. I suppose the pain I have suffered (and the fact that I am a Sagittarius) has made me a very compassionate person and I really do care about all of you and I am so glad that I found this blog and so very grateful for David’s emails every day. This blog to me is like a virtual support group with everyone being able to share what they have and are experiencing. And I agree if we knew each other before we become friends here I doubt we could have been so open with our lives but I have to admit that I would love to meet all of you. And my email is available for anyone who wants to contact me that way: angryaswipe@gmail.com
I was never supposed to be able to get pregnant, something to do with defective Fallopian Tubes always causing excruciating periods and very irregular, sometimes going for up to 4 months without and then having one that would last for months. 2 D&Cs and no relief, just grin and bear it. But something happened when we were living in Tuscon, AZ and I started to have regular periods for a while and then they stopped and i thought the morning sickness (which lasted all day long) was a bad case of flu that I couldn’t git rid of. I was a waitress in a small cafe and bacon was always the special and every time I would smell bacon cooking I had to run to the restroom. My daughter is truly a miracle, a gift from God, and I live to see her have a healthy grip on this Bi-polar disorder so she can survive when I am gone. But she actually saved my life because when I found out I was pregnant my ob made me have a pap smear, as routine prenatal care. I tried to decline because less than 10 months earlier I had a clean pap done. My ob insisted and this one came up with cancer of the cervix. I went home and told my now ex what was going on and he said “How much is this going to cost me?” Like he ever held a steady job and paid for anything! I was totally exasperated with his reaction. But he is the worst of the Bi-polars no diagnosis! So they kept an eye on the cancer while I was pregnant and as soon as she was born the drs wanted me to get the cancer taken care of because it was advancing at quick pace. So I weighed my choices and looked at who I was probably going to spend my life with and opted for the sure thing; hysterectomy. I sometimes regret that decision but I really think it was the right one. My child has suffered so much from BPD and all the other things that come with it in certain people that I would not have wanted to have another child suffer as she has and still does and always will. Anyways thanks for your kind words and your openness. I have plenty of experience in dealing with Bipolar from both sides of the road and all I am capable of at this stage in my emphysema is to use the internet and some very easy household tasks so I spend more time on the net than anywhere else. That is how I have time to try and help Donna and anyone else who I can offer a word of encouragement to and Pray for their suffering to cease. Right now Heaven is in a lot of mental anguish and needs us to gang up together and Pray for her to find an appropriate Psychiatrist before she actually commits suicide. I am so afraid for her and her Mother, as she has a mother who is similar to me as in wanting to help her. And I fear that if Heaven does commit suicide then that will be the end of her mother as well. She is so depressed right now and seems to sink lower every day so please, you all, help me with the Praying for her. I believe in the power of Prayer and I know that things will get better for her, if she can handle it long enough. Enough for now. I think I have for sure written a book today. Thank you all and especially to you Marni, with Love and Prayers, Your Friend, Helen

Helen, the commonality of so experiences that you and Tany and I share amaze me. I am so sorry that you did to yourself what you knew better by continuing to smoke. The same thing happened to my Aunt and Dad. My aunt never ceased to smoke and died of lung cancer that spread to the brain. My Dad died of pancreatic cancer that spread to the kidneys, always a terminal illness. I cannot express to you how much I miss him. He never thought “it would get him”, so never seriously tried to quit smoking until his diagnosis; of course by then it was a done deal. I was with him in the doc’s office when we were told that Dad was definitely dying and had a short time left to live. The shock was unspeakable to him, my Mom, and me. It’s one thing in theory, right? It’s totally something else when it’s real. So my heart is truly with you. I think you definitely did the right thing by having the hysterectomy b/c cure of cancer is always pretty if-y, and you are having precious time with your daughter. It’s obvious how very much you love her. You have taught her so much about life and even BPD, and I believe she WILL be OK. I believe, too, that God will always put any needed people around her. So be at peace as best you can. Nothing can screw a person up like sexual abuse, and it often does implant a self-destruct button in a person in spite of themselves. It takes so much to overcome those experiences b/c they strike right at the very heart of who you are, and alter so drastically the person you were meant to be. There’s nothing more I can say, but understanding from another who has been there is so comforting. That is why my favorite Bible teacher is Joyce Meyer b/c she was abused my her father from age 3 to 18,
at which time she left home. She has turned 40 years of being restored into awesome ministry and is totally out there about that and how it affected her for the majority of her life. She wrote “The Penny” and “Beauty for Ashes” and tons of other books. So even if you’re not a Christian per se, I do believe her books would inspire you if you are a reader. She also has pod casts. So if you’re interested type Joyce Meyer Minintries into your search engine and it will give you her website. She has helped me more than I can possibly say. I was able to attend one of her conferences and she was so funny as well as honest. She is extremely straigtforward which can turn some people off, but I appreciate it. I know she IS for real. I miss hearing from Donna, and I will lift her up. I carry all of you in my thoughts and on my heart all day and ask God for His interventions in your lives to bring about good and happiness, and to give wisdom and protection to you. I pray He will bring you mental and emotional relief, Helen, about anything that causes you anxiety throughout your days.
Who Is Heaven? You speak as if Heaven is a person so I’m confused as to what you mean by your requests, and I’m wondering if you mean Donna or something about her? Please explain this to me. Because of your loving and caring concern for others, I am sure you have been and are an inspiration to those who know you. I’m glad you’ve found this “virtual” support group. Love, Marni

Hi all,
I have been really busy jsut trying to maintain my life. Helen, No we are not married, thank God, I don’t have any idea of how much debt he is really in and I am glad that it is not my problem. I hope the child support goes through quickly as well, it’s geting really tough meeting expenses. I hope he doesn’t try to come back, in fact I don’t want to see him at all. As for visitation and everything, I really don’t think that will be an issue, she’s 9 now and they still have no relationship. He only has had negative things to say about her which were all very stupid. Gunzee, I feel for you so much. It’s so hard trying to stick by someone you love when you feel so bad. I believe that she loves you but is that enough for you? Only you know the answer. Marni and Tanya, listening to you let’s me know that you can try to mange this is you want too and my ex just didn’t want to. I will keep in touch with you all I feel that if it weren’t for you I wouldn’t have been able to maintain strength to do what I needto do.
Friend always.

BTW guys I think this has to be the longest running blog in history!

Hi, Tanya, Man, that jealousy dragon is beginning to get stronger and stronger. He’s been spending time with the youngest one there, b/c they are often paired up in the lobby of the testing center to admit the ones who have registered for the test. He was mentioning to me that in talking with her, he was apeculating about some things about the testing center…innocuous. But immediately I take the bait…”Did you say that to Carleen and Phil also?” “No, just Carissa.” That let me know they were a) alone and b) they are becoming friends, and she was the most introverted and perfectionistic one of the bunch. She really kept to herself. But as Bill teased her, and made fun of her in his witty way, she warmed up to him, and now she’s teasing him back and they’re talking about the center, which is small, and in fact, she may be in charge of it soon, as she interviewed for the job. She’s also going to school and is married. Is there anything unusual in any of this? No. Is this typically Bill, making poeple feel comfortable around him and problem-solving wherevenr he works? Yes, Has he ever been unfaithful? No. Is he handsome? Not at first until you become familiar with his Japenese features and he’s very much so. Is it his personality that draws people to begin to confide in him? Yes. So how do I handle this? He’s starting to read me b/c I’m not at all good at hiding my feelings, especially when it comes to this…moments of silence as I’m trying to process the whole thing he’s become very sensitive to. Did you know there’s such a term as an “ambivert”? There is. And that’s me in my “right mind”. I ride the line between being an introvert and an extrovert, which makes me very talkative and outgoing a lot of the time, and quiet and withdrawn at others just naturally. But I put out the strongest vibs ever in spite of myself. I guess it’s the intensity of the emotions you brought up and we discussed earlier. My emotions are the strongest part of me, and it has taken my whole life to learn to “balance” them with reason. I have an extreme problem with insecurity and feel that I make a good first impression but as a person gets to know the real me, that first impression steadily changes until they reject me, in my mind. I’ve asked about this to the people I know and love, my family, and they always tell me I am to sensitive and that people really take to me for the most part. I just kind of walk around with an automatic “reject” button, trying to stay quiet and unobtrusive until I sponeously forget this control and talk and express opinions and the extrovert comes out in me. So people tend to try to put me in leadership positions which I used to accept. After awhile the stress I created within myself would cause me to come up with some viable excuse to give the position up. I’m going into this b/c you mentioned our mutual insecurity orientation to the external world. It doesn’t help that I have an external-locus motivation rather than internal, which makes me ruled by others’ opinions of me and my standards and what I do, rather than being true to myself regardless of what others think. Bill has an internal-locus and can just brush things off. Peoples’ opinions don’t matter that much to him. The only one who can knock him off of his center is me. Enough, already!!! You say you “rabbit”..I have you beat by a mile! Blessings and love, Marni Thanks for letting me vent about this huge jealousy issue. It might force me back into counseling. It didn’t do much good in El Paso, but maybe having a different one up here who doesn’t know me at all will give a new perspective and approach. I hate living with this constant, gut-wrenching suspicion and possessiveness and threat. UGH!!

Tanya, “Ifyou could see what I see”. I can’t even begin to tell you how often Bill has said that to me. And I know you’re right…the past is the past. I’ve just got this thing I have to deal with one way or the other. Also, I’m having a hard time, at the beginning of an episode, at it’s been so hard with Todd and his girlffien here. The whole point was for us to meet his girlfriend, and at first all went well. But I am feeling so very vulnerable…and again the good first impression thing. I haven’t been able to hid the nerves and irritable impatience from in front of them, and she is nervous now and pretty closed, and I blame myself even tho’ I know the best I can. I keep your posts and frequently reread them. I am a child, too. I think that’s the hardest thing to take, and it seems the older I get, the more childlike I am. She will be leaving tomorrow morning and I think a lot of the stress will lift. Todd found out a while back from my oldest daughter that I am bipolar, but not in much detail. So I don’t know how much he knows about it, and since he held a deep and angry grudge against for about ten years of my relationship with Bill, our newfound friendship feels so fragile to me. Tanya, I am so afriad of blowing it. I have a hard time with both of my stepkids,,they are brilliant achievers, but also very judgemental of others who they think are stupid. Bill, Todd, Tianna…the one thing they all say is that they can’t stand stupid people. I am by no means stupid, that’s not what I’m saying. Their Dad is so precious to them, and I am so different from them, I raised my kids so differently..it’s almost polar opposites. It’s really east to feel like they look down their noses at me and Michael, my son. Me b/c I became their rival when their Dad fell for me b/c they had had him to all themselves for a number of years, and Todd was, of course, hoping for a reconciliation between Bill and his Mom. Anyway, I’ve gotten off of the routine of eating, sleeping and exercise so I’ve been taking my meds at irregular times. You know exactly what that does. I told Gunzee that others could support but that it’s up to ME to manage the disorder. I’ve stopped doing what I know I must do, and so a depression has got me down. I just don’t want to be around anybody, let alone people I always feel judged by or fear they will call me “psycho woman” behind my back. No S—t. I’ve heard them speak that way about others plenty. This is what I mean about having an external-locus of control. I just don’t have much strength to stand up against what others think of me. Not yet, anyway. But I never say die…somehow I keep on trucking one foot in front of the other. You know exactly what I mean. Thank you so much for sharing what Fred says to you and how much he loves you. May you continue to enjoy the intimacy you haven’t been able to for awhile, in fact, glory in it. People do tell me I’m pretty and intelligent and perceptive…and I’ve kind of got that now. It’s their acceptance and above all their approval that makes me afraid and make me feel less than…I need to see if they’re still awake so I can say goodbye to her. Again, thanks so much for being in my corner. Love, Marni

Ay, girl, You are funny!! I, too, hope you don’t fall into a funk after the high. Take those meds on time!! Hummmmm 🙂
You have to laugh, right? I remember Dave’s blog on the need for a sense of humor. Things are better since she left. Bill and Todd are working on the house and I’ll be babysitting my grandchild soon. I’m not in the mood, but I love him to pieces and I know it keeps me engaged in the world. May the sky always be blue and the grass always be green…Love, Marni

Hi all,
I am hanging in there. I just heard that the place where my ex works is having a huge layoff. I just hope it’s not him or I’m in big trouble. Emotionally, sometimes I go into thewishful thinking and then i remember how bad it was and that he left without paying for anything and he has no intentions of it or talking to his daughter and he could careless if we were homeless and the fantasy goes away. Yesterday a friend of mine from where I used to live, came to town and took me and Serenity out to dinner. It was really nice, he opened doors for her and let her order anything she wanted off the menu, they had a political debate ( yes, with a 9 year old) and she actually laughed!!! We have been friend for a long time, he knows that that’s all we could ever be and Serenity knows it too so there was absolutly no pressure. Thanks for thinking of me and I am thinking of you too.
Friends always,
Donna

Hi, Donna, Everything that Tanya said…DITTO!!!!
Friends, Marni

hey all,
Get this, he dropped off paperwork for me to do his modification of his chld support order, as if it is my responsibilty. the nerve!! He wants me to do the order and file it in court for him so that he won’t have to go into the court room where he used to sit on the bench. Well, I had nothing to do with that and yes he is entitled to a modification but it is his resonsibility to do it not mine, i’m so out done!

Hi, Gunzee, I’m still kind of wondering what you’re thinking about all of the info. I shared with you in my last post to you on the blog. I want to stress very much that you may not agree with some or any of what I wrote b/c of your own experiences. That’s fine with me, I just don’t want to leave you offended w/o knowing it. I hope you’re finding more answers all of the time. Friends, Marni

Hi all:
Been having some “Non Bi-polar” drama going on with my husband’s 32 y/o alcoholic son. Monday night he got a load going and came down here banging on the house all around to get us up. Well it worked but we know better than to let him in while he is drunk as he gets very violent. This time he almost sent my daughter back into her Manic Episode we are fighting so hard to get her stabilized from and I was awake all night, I guess I was on high alert because I know how violent he can be and he typically attacks his Dad, physically if he can get close enough and I will be damned if I will let him get close enough! He will not lay a hand to me, at least so far, because I remind him of his dead mother, who is the reason he acts the way he does when he is drunk, go figure. Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome for this kid because of all the rotten and mean things she did to him while he was a teenager. I have been told that she was a very bitter, hateful, and spiteful woman. The common ground for us is we are similar in looks. Don’t mean to speak bad of the dead but I could never be the way that woman was. I was told that she even told her mother she wished she would die and then when she did after a week or so, Della totally lost it and became even worse than she had been before. It is so sad for all her kids (7 altogether)and I don’t want to put my step-son in jail, I will if I have to, but try to avoid it because I know jail won’t make any difference, he needs a Psych very badly but never has the money because any money left over after most of his bills are paid gets spent on booze. Anyway back to what I wanted to say is more for Donna and backing up Marni in what she said.
Donna: Harden up your heart and close it off as much as you can and then (make sure you can do it) confront him again, give him back his papers and let him know he is responsible for whatever he does and that is that. You have no obligation to do anything for him at all and do you very best to let him know this because this is a ploy to get back into your life again and if you do this there will be something else that he wants you to do for him and so on until you are right back where you started again. I know this vicious cycle as I have lived it over and over again with my daughter’s father until I got married this last time and then he would use visitation as a way to be close to me and believe me, my husband didn’t appreciate it at all and as soon as my Katy turned 18 he let him know that he had to make arrangements for visitation at another locale. So if you are not sure you can do this right now, have a friend do it for you. You are rid of him and his pain he so loves to put on you, but you have to be tough enough to keep it that way and the heart can really mess up the best of plans. Good luck and hugs and Prayers for you and remember do not let your head listen to your heart because you are very vulnerable right now. I believe all of us, your cyber friends, are a very good support group for you right now so take advantage of it.
For Marni: We have so much in common it is almost like we could have been sisters because once again you said that this is only blog you have ever posted to and that goes for me too. My daughter set me with several social sites like MySpace and I have no idea what else, but this is the only one I use and I use it as a therapist and all the support I receive from every one really is like a virtual support group. Maybe one of these days The Good Lord will bring us all together to meet in person. It would truly be a Miracle as I know we are scattered everywhere but it is rather ironic how one blog can bring about new friends! Love and Prayers or all of you, Helen BTW I feel so much more better with having to know all of you so well, even though we have never really met, I really feel as if I have some great friends now that wouldn’t turn on me in a New York minute! Thanks to all of you! Sorry I know I have been rambling on so I guess I am still a little manic, but I what I say here is truly how I see it and I mean every word I say.

Marni and Helen:
I am not going to do it however, I don’t want to see him or talk to him right now. Do you think he will get the message if I just don’t answer the phone?

No, Donna…and you’re understandably avoiding the confrontation. I think Helen’s idea is the best of all if you’re not ready to face him yourself with that line drawn in the sand…have a mediator whose in your corner do it for you. Do you have any lawyer friends, not his but yours, who might do this for you for free? Wish I were there. GRRRR! So, no, avoiding the phone won’t help. He’ll be persistant and find other ways to get to you. Friends, Marni

Hi, Gunzee, Great to hear from you. I don’t know if you have read the posts between Tanya and me a while back. We were talking about the intensity of a BIPO’s emotions even in his NATURAL temperatment. So the emotionalism can get way, way intense when in a manic or depressive state. What is really confusing is when those states are simultaneous. That happens with me quite a bit and it’s really confusing to us both. How can I be so restless, active, talkative, etc. while I still want to sleep a lot and have no appetite and don’t want to go out? I’m high, yet still sad, unhappy and isolate…and yes, cry easily. When really manic, I get loud, exuberant, overbearing and overwhelming to others. My judgment gets squewed, I have different compulsions to different degrees like spending (I am almost totally free of this, thank God), over-generous to a fault as if I need to be charitable to the whole world, and anger easily into a total rage. When I am depressed, I’m typical. I don’t want to do anything, chores and responsibilities seem overwhelming, bed is an escape, I am a black hole for others to be around and drain their energy, and I’m sarcastic. If I’m jealous, I get really sarcastic and biting. I get argumentative. So you can see why we need to keep me stable. I’m a real pain when I’m not. When I’m in a mixed state, I get into the self-destruct thing. I only tried to commit suicide once (age 18) and it was so close. I don’t know how I was saved, but I was. So instead, I’ll carelessly and uncaringly, place myself in harmful situations, or if I find myself in a potential one, I surrender to it instead of taking proper precautions like a rational person would. Also when I am truly manic, I speak continually in rhyme, write in rhyme and sing in rhyme. If it wasn’t a sign of being manic, it is actually pretty cool. But it only happens when manic, so it is a classic and undeniable symptom. Geez. Lastly, I’m a touchy person to begin with, melacholic and take everything personally. So if in an episode w/o great controls, I will be vindictive against those who I feel have hurt me. By the time we left El Paso, everyone at Bill’s small (alternative high school) knew beyond any doubt at all that I really hated them. Bill would joke with them about changing his phone number after he retired so they couldn’t bother him with poblems. (I used to say that if DAD would leave the campus, maybe the kiddies would grow up.) Well, occassion presented itself when one of the counselors told me about Bill’s joke, I said, “well, if he doesn’t, I WILL.” She was so shocked and couldn’t tell if I was kidding. The last day the staff had to report, and the final day Bill had to be on campus, he was through with everything he needed to do. I was there and thought we would be going home at the same time, but he wanted to stay (until the bitter end for me). I told him that he had finished everything and to please let’s just go home. But, no, he wanted to spend all the time he could with his co-workers. Among many other jobs he took upon himself, h was the campus tech, in charge of fixing and overseeing over 100 computers, and he was the Dept. Chair of the campus Eng. Dept. His teachers were all women who had had to work closely with him being new teachers. So, in an extreme rage and hurt (typically manic), I went and changed his cell phone number b/c the account was under my name and we only had cells. Then I couldn’t figure out how to tell him b/c I knew he would be furious. Eventually he saw it w/o my telling him, and yep, he was furious BUT he stayed relatively calm knowing I was in a dangerous state, and reasoned with me that I just can’t disrepect him to that degree. I don’t know how he deals with his anger when I’m not around, but I do know he doesn’t talk about it with others. That’s why I think he says God gives him the grace and he finds release and comfort in his part of the worship team at church. He loves to sing and play guitar. We moved soon after.

At first, the most difficult thing is to be able to separate the acting out of the disorder from the natural personality..and depending on what else is going on with her, hormones. Those little pests can really mess a lady up either continually or sporadically. You have quite a task, in a way, but all you can do is observe, maybe keep a mood chart yourself at the end of the day as you’ve observed her in the midst of ALL THE OTHER STUFF ON YOUR PLATE, RIGHT? And talking to her when she does seem stable and not so emotional. These changes from moment to moment on her part really blindside you, don’t they? Whatever else you do, try to keep a part of you detached, able to step back and not take anything personally when she’s in her moods. Bill’s objectivity and ability at last, to stay pretty unperturbed whatever I say or do, helps me not to feel guilty b/c I’m not hurting him as badly as at first. He has learned and still is learning to protect himself even as he continues to love and support me. He still gets lulled into a false security somethimes, though, when I am stable, so that as subtle changes occur that indicate a trigger has set me off into an episode, he still gets blindsided when I act out more strongly. Medications are vital, as are the correct dosages, as you’re finding out, but episodes can still occur. A trigger is a situation, a person, a thing, whatever the BIPO is really sensitive to beyond control, and that can take precedence over the effects of the medication. That’s one reason you hear of medicated, well-managing individuals coming into a new episode. My biggest trigger is if I think or see another woman getting personal with Bill, not intimate, but just not talking about WORK!!! It’s ridiculous!! BUT it is so strong, it will drive me into a huge manic/depressive episode almost every time I see it happening. I know he’s not interested in that lady other than as a co-worker, and that he would never in a million years leave me, but just the fact they are scheduled alone to work, and that it means they have to spend the time doing something besides working with test registered people, so they will naturally talk.. Talking leads to more knowledge about each other’s lives even superficially and eventually more and more. Bill is really good in keeping boundaries on his side b/c he’s private to begin with, But I do not trust other women, period. So that is a real problem. That is a major trigger that will set me off w/o fail right now.
He knows it, and the unfortunate result is that he doesn’t share as openly with me about a big part of his life, b/c he is cautious not knowing which piece of info. will set me off. That results in me saddness that I have shut him down, and SADDLY, it increases my paranoia b/c the less I know, the more my imagination starts to work which kicks in the episode even more. It makes me want to spy on him in any way I can. In El Paso, I knew the people really well that he worked with and knew the environment. His original environment was no problem to me, mostly guys and friends. As the face of the staff began to change, and as he came home with lots of stories about the lives of his co-workers who had b/come mostly female, some doggone pretty, things like their marriages (!), the first and most intense, irrational, and long-lived manic episode ever in my life with Bill, most intense in my own life,
occurred. All told, it probably lasted a good 18 months, and had he not moved us and retired, I would have undoubtedly ended up hospitalized….and what is the scariest thing about it all? Not meds, not counseling, not reasoning it out with him, curtailed it. It was a train constantly speeding up w/o control. So this is a personal sharing, and I thank God that your girlfriend is still not that extreme. Pray God she never will be. The point is to recognize HER triggers. Some will be minor and some major. The more you know about them, the better you can prepare and even perhaps interrupt their descent into an episode. It’s so humbling to have admit all of this, Gunzee. I can only do this b/c you’re a friend who only knows me here and I feel safer. I don’t feel anyone I know in any other place of my life safe, so I don’t disclose anything at all. That’s why I think we’re all here. We get safe support and can say whatever we need to to get help and hopefully, to help others. Take care and stay in touch. It’s really good to hear from you. Friends, Marni PS I’ve stopped proof-reading, so whatever mistakes there are, I hope the sentences make sense. Til soon….

No, Donna, I meant to you have a friend to act as a mediary for you to go to him or call him FOR you for awhile until you can face him yourself. I mentioned “lawyer” in the context of do you have a lawyer FRIEND who could do this for you? I’m sorry I confused you!!! :). Marni

A big hello to everyone, aplogies for no names but have decided to tranq up to control manicness. Poor memory now. I embaressed my partner the other day by shouting at the top of my voice I want sex repeatedly no joke we got some fruity replies at least I did not take my clothes off this time. The high is great but the no control stuff I do is not. WIll be back in touch when more stable. Lovely to read the blogs big hugs to all especially Marni thanks my friend for your kind heart. BFN Tanya 🙂

Hey, all….I’m not getting anything done around here. GREAT BLOGGING WITH YOU ALL TODAY. I have to step it up double-time, b/c my girls and grandkids are coming over. Love you all, Marni

Oh, TAAANNNYYYYAAAA! Better hear from you TTTOOOOMMMMOOORRROOOWWWW…..
“Cyber” hugs, Marni

Hey Gunzee…One more thing really important..my hatred towards Bill’s school and co-workers was not just about the women and staff..it was that he lived, ate, and breathed his school for about 10 months as he knew he was coming upon retirement. All he could think about and talk about was the school and the people. He stayed late often to work on the computers. For my part, I knew I was getting ill, and I was trying to tell him all I wanted him to do was pace himself. He would come home exhausted, in pain, eat, isolate to restore in his office, and go to bed too tired for sex or cuddling or talk, the intimate things that glue a relationship. I finally got him to veg in front of the TV set. I tried and tried to tell him how much I missed him and that I wanted our life, after school. On his part, he wanted “a woman to stand by him” as he came up on big turning point in his life. I really wish I could have. I started having panic attacks and being afraid to be home alone. I knew that I knew that I knew I was feeling all of the same things to the same degree that I was feeling in Phoenix for about six months before I was hopitatilized. There for the fist time, I felt I was truly losing my mind, losing a grip on reality. So I tried desperately to get Bill’s attention.Iwas downhill from there on. I was only recently diagnosed with Bipolar and we were newbies at it. So I repeatedly told him all he cared about was school, in fact, he was MARRIED to it. My jealousy of the time, the staff, the responsibilities that were stealing his energy and love and attention at the time I needed him MOST was the deal-breaker. That’s why I made the people there the target of my extreme feelings of panic, fear, and betrayal. It still stings us both. Hope this clarifies the whole picture. You, I’m sure, want your girl to stand by you…and that is so valid. Just observe and see how much of that she can really do and give her lots of encouragement. She feels like a real failure right now, I bet. As TAnya says, big cyber hug…Friends, Marni

Donna:
If you mail the paperwork back to him, which is probably a good idea, make sure that you send it certified with receipt requested that way you have proof that he received it or denied it and can’t come back with “Donna kept the paperwork so I assumed she helped me out and filled them out and took of them for me” deal. Just be extremely cautious because I know a lot of the tricks that will end up with “poor poor pitiful me I was wrong and I love you and you love me so we need to get back together for our daughter’s sake and our love’s sake too”. And your heart is not ready for any of this stuff yet because your heart will cave in and shut out your brain, so be careful. Wish I was there to get your back. Love and Prayers and beware. Love, Helen

Helen,
I wish I had thought of that before I mailed them but I didn’t. Afterall, it really doesn’t matter if he says he didn’t get them. He said that he would call on Wednesday and he didn’t so as far as he knows they were still here here right> Besides he would have to signed the agreed order to not go to court so you would think that he was trying to get them and lying about he thought I took care of it is stupid because he would have signed it. When he does get them with the note saying ” I do believe this is your resposibility” he will know that I’m not doing it. I got a call this AM from his second job, she didn’t know that he was not here and I don’t know if he didn’t show up to work last night but she was able to reach him on somebody’s cell phone so he’s not missing in action. Anyway, I hope that he doesn’t dig himself in a deeper hole than he already is, 22,480 in back support. He must have really thought that I was stupid! I think I can deal with whatever he says but just in my own way. It’s amazing how God works and how he can give you strength and friend when you need them most. You all are with me everyday and I know that you have my back.
Love, Friends and prayers,
Donna

Hey, Gunzee, You might not get this in time, but I do think you should write her. You’ve already done that face-to-face talks more than once and it’s just frustrating you both. She’s being controlled by Fear right now, and probably some distorted thinking. Anything you say using “you”, she’ll take as accusation and so will you, when she uses it. An ods counseling trick is to use “I” when expressing feelings and needs. “When you do (say) such and such, I feel (or take it as…). If you can do this whether verbally or in writing, and stay detached when she uses accusative arguments, you might have some actual communication. A lot of Bipolars aren’t diagnosed until their 40s or 50s for some reason, and she’s turning 40. She may still be having periods which can really mess a woman up, especailly if she’s approaching peri-menopause, the stage before menopause. So her moods swings could be drastic from that. If they are from being Bipolar, you won’t get that exact girl back that you originally met and loved. When normal, she’ll be close, but it will not be the same. Can you come to a place of making peace with that? Bill wanted to leave me, too, at the beginning like you, but was so confused. Would I be OK? Did he still love me? Could he face a life like this? In the end, he chose to stay and fight the Bipolar out with me. Truth to tell, I was controlled by fear and very much into distorted thinking; if he would have left, I know I would have done something drastic. That doesn’t mean she will. Bill went to counseling a few times where he could vent, get angry, talk out his confusion, and clarify the best ways for him to cope with me. I admire him and respect him greatly for that, b/c it takes a lot for a man to seek counseling. He felt much more in control. I hope this helps, Gunzee. I’m sad for you, too. Believe me, what you are going through is truly traumatic. You can always tell your friend you’re a little too busy right now to plan a party, and that you’ll have to work with her later on it when your calendar clears up. Carrying you on my heart, Marni

Tanya, Just letting you know I am thinking of you always, and praying for you. Til later, Cyber hugs, girlfriend, Marni

A big hello to everyone,

Donna keep strong girl, what a meanie owing all that child support. It takes two to tango.

Gunzee I am 40 today to Happy Birthday to me and I don’t do crowds or social events so made sure I had no party Fred taking me off for a few days next week. You sound so pulled in two different directions like the clash song should I stay or should I go now. I would feel terrible today if I made Fred feel what you do my heart goes out to you, somehow you need to get your side of things/feelings across there are two people in your relationship you deserve to be happy too. Fred said to me today you are so much happier when I never say No to you, sometimes your bipolar moods occur when you don’t get your own way, some truth in that I am ashamed to say, truth hurts, but truth heals, be truthful it will set you free.

Marni HHHEEELLLOOO you always make me smile. Thank you for being you. Glad to have found you. Big Hugs Tanya 🙂 PS I feel a lot calmer now thank goodness.

Hi all,

Just an update.. was all ready to talk to her tonight. I get home, she had made a fabulous dinner, told me she was having a hard day and she really needed me, gave me hugs and kisses, told me she loved me, and to top it off, she stopped at the mall to get a Mom’s day gift and ended up buying me a great shirt. Go figure. This roller coaster never ends. Now what do I do? An I supposed to feel bad about almost leaving today? Do I talk to her anyway and ruin a somewhat good night??/ AHHHHH

Hi, Donna…I think a lot of people got that from Dave’s blog, don’t ask why. He clarified that you can’t ask someone in a bipolar episode why? I think it’s perfectly valid to ask why in a lot of situations. But when it comes to human behavior, there’s usually not a lot of answers. It just is as it is. Blessings, Marni

Hi, Gunzee, She really does have you on a roller-coaster. I’m right there with you as you write your posts to us. This is the exact kind of thing you can use in a letter to illustrate to her what you mean about her really confusing behavior. Good luck, and we care about you. I wish at least one of us could come up with magic answers. Wouldn’t that be great? Marni

Hi Gunzee:
I believe Marni is onto something. Keep a diary, write in it everything that you feel as you write in what she has done to make you feel this way and when she is stable enough, give it to her to read. Might make things better and as you write on this blog, I don’t think it would hurt anything for her to read or maybe even video tape what she is saying and doing and then fill in how it makes you feel. The sneaky part is to not let her know you are recording how she is because that could bring on a major manic episode. So be careful with it. Best wishes and Prayers for you and to have peace and happiness in your life. Helen

Gunzee,
I know that rollercoaster all so well. Eventhough it was a good night, you know as well as I that that could change so very quickly. I hope you talked with her anyway just to get it over with. You know how it’s going to go and I don’t think that she doesn’t know how you feel she is just being herself. ( can’t I of all people just said that) anyway, let us know how it went and remember we are your friends!
Friends,
Donna

Marni,
Thanks for the words of encouragement. You are a true friend. I know that I will make it and you all have been such a support to me. WE WILL MAKE IT!!!!!
Friends,
Donna

Hi Marni & Gunzee,

If you want to get in touch my email is: tanya.lacey@googlemail.com.

Hope you get this.

Big Hugs
Tanya 🙂