=>PLEASE FORWARD TO FRIENDS, FAMILY AND LOVED ONES <=
Hi,
How’s it going?
Hey, I have a whole lot of good
news going on.
First, I have a new company that
is going to be managing a lot of my
advertising to try to control the costs
that are getting way, out of control.
Secondly, we have a new mentorship
program when if you start working for
me and have bipolar disorder, I will
pair you with a person who currently
works for me and have been successful
for a while. This way new people with
bipolar working and be mentored by older
people who have bipolar.
The goal is to get the newer up to the
level the older person is. We feel in
the organization that doctors and therapists
are great but a person who has bipolar and
is successfully working can help a new person
looking to achieve that goal.
Anyway, the program started yesterday.
So today I wanted quickly to tell you
something.
Yesterday I wrote a message about how
I have a friend that told me that
his brother had bipolar disorder and
now it seems my friend actually has
the disorder and that’s why he has
not been doing well for years.
I was writing how my friend was driving
me crazy last night with all this fast
talk and talk of people out to get
him.
Last night my friend called and was totally
calm and made perfect sense. It was rather
interesting.
This tends to happen. My friend is able to
talk normal to me many times but who knows
what he is like when I am not on the phone.
My friend knows that I know bipolar and
let’s face it, is probably trying to
manipulate me by acting really calm
so that I don’t catch on to his situation
of whether or not he has bipolar disorder.
To see the entire message what happen
the other day, and the numerous
bipolar lessons learned, see my blog below.
Anyway, people wrote me that they were sorry
and I appreciate that.
Then a bunch of people wrote me to be careful
not to get caught up in my friend’s bipolar
episodes if he has bipolar disorder.
Believe me, I sure won’t.
Here’s what I wanted to tell you. I thought
about this and there is no way that I can
spend a lot of time like I put into my mom
to help my friend. My friend is in total
denial with whatever he has and so is his
family. It would be a gigantic up hill
battle for me to do all that needs to be done
and right now I don’t have the energy or time.
Some might find this mean. There’s no question
if my friend asks me for specific help I would
help. If his family contacts me, I would let them
have access to all my material.
But as for me handing it all and doing it
all, I am not going to.
Why? Am I a mean guy? No. I just know my
limits and that’s something that many
bipolar supporters have trouble with.
Let’s talk about it.
You might think that I don’t know my
limits because it looks like I do a whole
lot of work every day related to bipolar
disorder. And I do for sure. Why? Well
I really like doing this kind of stuff.
But, I say no a whole lot every day.
There are MANY things that I don’t do
and won’t do.
When you are a bipolar supporter, you’re
going to have to say no and prioritize.
At first if you have a close friend or loved
one with bipolar disorder, you have to decide
if you are doing to help the person.
Once you do, you then have to get all the
information on what to do. You need how to
do it and strategy information.
You can get it from people like myself
in my courses/systems below:
SUPPORTING AN ADULT WITH BIPOLAR DISORDER?
Visit:
http://www.bipolarsupporter.com/report11
SUPPORTING A CHILD/TEEN WITH BIPOLAR DISORDER?
Visit:
http://www.bipolarparenting.com
HAVE BIPOLAR DISORDER?
Visit:
http://www.survivebipolar.net
OR, you can figure it out on your own
by calling doctors, therapists, finding
successful bipolar supporters, reading lots
of books, attending support groups and lectures
and then put together your own system.
With that said, you need a strategy however
you’re going to get one.
Then after that, you have to really focus on
your loved one and getting them into treatment,
a good doctor, helping get them on the right medication
with your doctor, and ultimately helping them
become stable.
Then after that, you have to start to clean up
the mess from the bipolar episode.
Then as you are doing this, as the person becomes
more and more stable, you turn over more responsibility
to them. You can’t expect someone in a major bipolar
episode to pay their bills, keep track of everything
that’s going on, fight off c.reditors if they exist,
etc.
But as time goes on, more and more responsibility
is turned back over to them.
Now as this is occurring you are going to have
to say no to a lot of stuff that you might not
say no to. Why? Well helping your loved one is
higher on the priority list and the other stuff
is lower on the priority list.
And you have to remember if you don’t say no
to other stuff you normally do, you will start
to burn out and almost have a breakdown.
You can only do so much at a time. When I was
helping my mom, I had to take a year off from work.
Now I could because I have my own business. I also
had to say no to hanging out with my girlfriend at
the time a lot and my friends. I had to skip
vacations and other things.
But as my mom got better, I then started doing
these things again. But I knew that I could put
all this effort into her and do all the same
things at the same time.
Now when it comes to my friend, I don’t have the
energy or time to be able to do all that needs
to be done especially with someone who is in total
denial he has anything to begin with. And, I now
run an organization where a whole lot of people
count on me so I have to be at my best and
can’t let the organization get dragged down.
There’s an old saying, “you can’t fight too many
battles at the same time.”
With that said, this is why I made this type of decision.
Some people may think this is rather mean than
me. This doesn’t mean that I would call emergency
services if my friend was going to harm himself
or something like that.
The bipolar supporter lesson is to make sure you set
your priorities, don’t take on too much, and make sure
when your loved one starts to get better, you turn
over the responsibilities back to them.
Some people make the mistake and don’t do the last step
and almost become a permanent caretaker for
someone with bipolar disorder.
Even with my mom, I refuse to fix all her problems
and enable her. She has to fix her own problems
these days and handle them. I have never felt
better since I started this new policy several
years ago. Back in the day, I fixed EVERYTHING.
EVERY problem went to me. It burned me out.
I won’t do that again.
Anyway, what do you think of this? I
have to run. Catch you tomorrow.
Your Friend,
Dave
P.S. Want your own copy of these daily bipolar
emails sent to you for F.ree? If so, visit:
http://www.bipolarcentral.com/register3
P.P.S. Don’t forget to take a look through the
different programs I’ve put together… each one is designed
to help you with a different area of bipolar disorder whether
you have it or you are supporting someone with it.
You can see them all and get the details by visiting:
http://www.bipolarcentral.com/catalog.asp
P.P.P.S. Check out my F.ree blog with copies of emails
that I have sent in the past and lots of great
information for you:
http://www.bipolarcentral.com/supporterblog/
P.P.P.P.S Check out my F.ree podcast. Hear me give
mini seminars designed to teach you information
you can’t learn anywhere else.
http://bipolarcentral.libsyn.com
Hi Dave,
I am 100% behind your decision. You have too much things on your mind to get involved in someones life, especially when this person is in denial.
If your friend admits he has a problem and he calls you to ask for help, than I assume you would spend 30 min of your time with him and his family to explain what is the right thing to do.
But to take full responsibility and support him all the way is far too much time and energy consuming.
Dave,
I often feel guilty for pulling away from my boyfriend/ex when he’s manic. It’s like the bp wants to DESTROY me…usually just me and he will not get help. As I wait for his mood to change, I beat myself up with all the shoulda, coulda, woulda.
Hi, Accuse spelling, I was told I had bipolar at 46, I am now 55. I have try over and over again to get my family to support me but they just keep there distance from me. However I have a wonderful psy and couserlor. I do wish when I ask for support, I could get some.
Walkfar
I have a bipolar mother, possibly with borderline personality disorder, who has created unbelievable chaos in our family for years. She is now elderly and we are at a loss as to what to do. She won’t take meds and blames her 3 daughters for all her problems, which are mostly in her head. How can I order your more extensive bipolar course. Thanks. Beth
Hi Dave,
this question is particularly for “jods”:
why are you with a bi-polar man?…oh you said “ex”. Does that mean you gave up on the situation?
also
I`d like to hear from anyone who loves their bi-polar spouse, partner and how they manage and also I seem to get the impression – although not directly stated – that there are some people with bi-polar and related disorders that actually achieve a state of some kind of equibrium,- w/ the help of meds and therapy…is this correct?
Thank you for your honesty. Only a person that’s been there and done that can probably even come close to knowing what your saying. It’s true that other people’s depression can bring those around them crashing down also. Keep your distance from those that are in denial, something will unavoidably happen to “Wake him up”, and all you can do is be there on the sidelines, ready to help the way you know how to. Thanks again. Your Mom is one lucky woman.
I would like to contact Nancy or Merrill for insight into BP…
thanks.
also, thanks to hailyboo for her comments a couple of days ago. very encouraging
Marag,
I wouldn’t say that I have given up entirely. After 10 months of affairs, lies, threats and accusations though we are not currently together. I didn’t know when I first started dating him that he was bp. It took a while to recognize the patterns. I first approached him about getting help almost a year ago but since he’s been manic…it’s like talking to a wall (a very mean wall). When he is “himself”…he is the sweetest, funniest, most sensitive person I have ever known. I truely don’t know a better human being. He’s only the devil when he’s manic and I understand he can’t help that. Both manic episodes I’ve witnessed with him were triggered by a major loss he suffered. He is super stubborn so he won’t get help; he thinks he can “handle” it. I DO NOT accept that!! I can’t watch him destroy himself and will not allow him to destroy me. They say you can’t help someone who won’t help themself so until he accepts that he CAN’T handle it on his own…I’m out.
People can become stable. I am with a bp man. With the right meds in place and taken at the same time everyday…that is something I have found out to be critical. And very important, no alcohol. It washes out the lithium and creates major swings. My loved one has not had a manic episode in years. Another thing that has helped is working. He is at his most stable point now that he is working. Someone asked, “why are you with a bp person?” People are not their illness, and thanks to David, when the mood swings do come, that is what I remind myself of. The swing is the bp talking and the person I love will be back. Removing myself from becoming brought down by the bp comments helps. One does get tired in the process of getting things right and like David said, “you have to say no” to some of the other things going on, but slowly you get back to them. That is where we are now. I am getting back to having some personal time and he is sucure with his new world. Oh, the additions from the past will always be a battle for him but he has willingly decided that a life living clean and free with me is what he wants. He also knows that I won’t tollerate self abuse. He is the one who must make the choice to live clean and free. This and following the doctors advise has been the key. I go to the doctor with him which helps the doctor see the whole picture (my love forgets things that are important to mention). Knowing what I can do and what I can not do gives me peace. Prayer helps too.
L
David, et al,
Quite right – that is not being mean. It is hard-nosed, not mean, and we’d expect you to be hard-nosed because it seem you are a successful businessman. No one succeeds in business by being a soft-touch – you have to be hard-nosed. That’s not a criticism because being hard-nosed is what it takes to run a business and employ people – there is little, or no, room for sentiment. That’s why most of us are not self-employed let alone running a business that employs people.
I suppose this simply amplifies what we all know which is that everyone is different. Some people can do things that others cannot. Some people can walk away from cries of help because they know they don’t have the time or resources to help, others cannot even if they don’t have the time or resources. That’s because their innate selves demands that they try anyway, even to the point of self sacrifice. That’s what so many supporters of BP are doing. Some folk will say it’s wrong to do that – and advise not to do it – but it isn’t intrinsically wrong or right, just a choice we make. No one can really say the choice is right or wrong – only we know what is right or wrong for us because no one else IS us. We are all unique, and what is good for one may be poison for another.
I often tell people to walk away when staying damages them. I do this often! But I wonder how I would react in their shoes. I doubt I would be any different because I would feel myself to be a total shit if I walked away, as I STILL do for walking away from a girl I met by chance who so obviously needed support and wanted me to give it. I walked away and she jumped under a train. This was 30 years ago and I STILL feel a total shit for doing it! Sure, one can say it was her choice but if you’re mentally ill (and given my knowledge now I’d guess she was Bipolar) it’s not a choice our rational selves would take, it’s what the illness kind of chooses for us. Besides, she was only 16! Not exactly an age for mature decisions. Sure, it wasn’t my fault it happened. But I didn’t do anything to help, didn’t do anything that just might have helped her turn the corner. I don’t feel guilty about it (anymore – I did) but I still feel a total shit because I walked a way, because I feared what people would think of a 22 year old young man getting involved with a girl of 16 … where we lived it would have been seen as “inappropriate” at best, signs of possible paedeophilia at worst. So, I walked away, more worried about how people might think about me than doing something, anything, to help her.
So, what do you imagine I do now when anyone says to me, “If xxx I’m going to kill myself.”? Go on, guess!
Call me old fashioned but I’ve always thought if you can’t have a child the natural way, nature doesn’t want you to have kids. But what do you think I did when my wife found she could not conceive the natural way and demanded IVF or “… I’ll kill myself…”? Yeah, I’ve resented the emotional blackmail ever since (even though I adore the two boys who arrived as a consequence), but I’d have suffered more if she’d carried out the threat. If I’d have been hard-nosed I’d have said “Go ahead, do it. Your choice.” But I didn’t. I couldn’t have lived with myself if I had, especially if she’d carried out the threat.
Someone has to pick up the broken glass. May be it’s meant to be me and x and y and z and b and c and f and so on. May be it’s meant to be that we’re pissed on by people who will manipulate us, too. But hey! That’s Karma. Do the crime, serve your time. That’s Karma. And it’s David’s, et al, Karma to be sensible and, when necessary, hard-nosed about business and about handling too many people signaling S.O.S.. He’d crash and burn if he tried to help them all. Well, may be some of us are meant to crash and burn in the attempt to support. It’s our choice and only we know what’s best for us – and to crash and burn may be what IS right for us.
PS
Guess what type of episode I’m in?!
P.S. Marag,
I was also with a man like the one you decribe. He thought he could manage it on his own and did not tell me he was bp. I stayed with him on and off for over 2 years. On when he was good, and off when he was “off”. What kind if life is that? I wanted more of the good side of him. He knows he will never be with anyone in a stable relationship until he takes meds and seeks help. You are right to get out becuase it will not change. What you see now is what you will continue to get until he makes a choice to change. My current love has made that choice and our love is powerful.
Hello Dave,
I am a bipolar supporter and I find it to be the most difficult undertaking that I have ever taken on.
However, my loved one now has two part time jobs, and has returned to school where she is thriving. She is committed to taking her medications and participating actively in her weekly therapy.
I see her growth, however, can never lower the bar. It is very trying some days, but her success and growing self esteen is worth it. I have committed myself to her development and have let go of other issues, relationships, vacations, even away on weekends with no regrets..although very difficult at times…Like you, would not survive without the gym….
Thank You,
Carole
Hi Dave,
Being in the midst of a serious case of burn-out and beyond myself, I finally reached my breaking point and now am determining at what point after 30 years of marriage (he wasn’t always this way – but I’d say it started very slowly and insidiously about 15 years ago)can I do anymore? You mentioned after an episode going on and fixing the mess…well, I’m finding myself fixing mess after mess, year after the year and now it’s so much of a mess I do not believe I can get caught up. For the past 5 years I’ve tried numerous ways to get my husband into a doctor and was unsuccessful – until this year -and some of you in this blog, can probably relate. This past fall I was able to get him some help and the doctor prescibed therapy, medications and exercise but he isn’t able to stay on any kind of routine. I found myself never giving up for him even until last week I felt his rage was so serious I packed up and left with my son. The next day a friend told me about NLP. I found a free conference, signed up for it myself, thinking I would gain some skills on how to deal with it, and told him about it, and he signed up. I did not go. But, the good news is, he’s there this weekend. I’m hoping it’ll get him started on the right path. NLP is a layman’s form of cognitive behavioral therapy. My current dilema is can I even be in the same house with him after that last episode – can I go back if he gets help? – he gets worse every time.
It’s horrible.
So, I agree with you Dave, there is only so much a human being is able to give. I like the idea of mentoring that you have come up. I think you’re really onto something. It might help the bipolar people in denial feel comfortable going to someone – and get the help they need a lot sooner. Also, a mentor might be able to get through to the biggest issues sooner.
Good luck on this new chapter of your business, and thank you for all you do!
Dear Dave, It’s been awhile since I’ve written. My guy has come and gone and come back again (residence) three more times. I called his doctor after speaking with his probation officer and his doctor was very aloof when I tried to explain what was happening and the events that were occurring and that maybe the doctor should look into bipolar disorder. P.S. The doctor stated that if there were anymore incidents that I should call him. When faced with yet another incident from my guy, I called the doctor only to have his nurse refuse to put me on the phone with the doctor, she yelled at me about the Hippa Laws and slammed the phone down on me. Not knowing that because I tried to convey the information, and she ignored me, should I suffer severe abuse, that she could be held liable for negligence. I am currently enrolled in an on-line University, seeking a Bachelors Degree in Paralegal Studies and then will be going on to Law School. I am maintaining a 4.0 so that one day I can approach people with the legal responsibilities that they have. I have found the Supreme Court Ruling which states that there is a “Claim of Privilege” “Similarly, the physician must know all that a patient can articulate in order to identify and to treat the disease. Barriers to full disclosure would impair diagnosis and treatment.” Burger C.J. Tramwell v. United States 445 U.S. (1980) this has to do with a spouse, clergy or anyone having knowledge that may help the doctor. I’m not giving legal advice, I am not an attorney. I am just stating what I have researched and found for myself. If I ever wanted to go to his attorney or approach the court in either his open case or as next of friend, or amicus curea (friend of the court)I could. For now, I am taking good care of me while making sure that I help him take care of himself.
For my fellow BP’s!!!
Today is International Disturbed People’s Day.
I don’t care if you lick windows, see dead people,
or occasionally pee yourself…
You hang in there sunshine,
you’re Bloody special.
Hi David, When your friend faces it he can do what we all did and you will be there for him like you are for the rest of us. This is a good thing, besides my son looking all crazy at me, that is when I know I must be blowen it, you are the only person there. My son he has known something was really wrong since he was 10, he is 24 now. I am still doing crazy stuff, like the blue Goerge Forman grill he bought, I smashed it the other day because it was blue-I have all red appliances in my kitchen. I am taking the meds-sill doing stupid stuff. I think he really liked to cook on that thing-it was blue?
Thanks, Karen
Isuffer from bipolar and as we speak am trying to fight off the manic part trying to take over, this person has to reconize his or her illness before ANYBODY can help. I am going into treatment in the morning, if I can last that long, otherwise it will be tonite. RECONIZE your warning signs .
Hi Dave,
I’m working on setting limits. My husband asked me on Saturday morning if I would get his prescription filled. I told him “no”, that he’d had all week to do that, and I’d appreciate it if he would start taking care of getting his prescriptions. (seems like I frequently did that in the past–kind of took that on as a way to “help” him). But in a small way, I think him getting his own meds means he’s taking responibility for his illness. This is a small example of saying “no”.
I can relate to “beyondburnout” because there is a point where we ARE cleaning up mess after mess after mess. And that becomes our life, which is NOT good.
to Walkfar, Your on track, be patient with family as takes time for them to get used to you being stable. Meanwhile lots here will talk to you, like I, kermodiebear@uniserve.com
Hi Dave and All,
Levels of commitment do vary according to the relationship. We have to acknowledge our limitations and make our choices according to priorities and what we need to do in order to live with ourselves (our conscience), as well as meet our own needs.
My husband was diagnosed to have BP about 7 years ago. I began reading Dave’s emails less than a year ago. What Dave says is extremely encouraging on the days I’ve felt the BP might be one up on me.
I have learned much on my own and it’s nice to have someone that agrees or reminds me of these things. I do this for me and it benefits my husband and helps keep him stable. Yes, he is also on medication, he does seem to have a good, knowledgable Dr., and I am his therapist. I’m not a professional, either. I do believe in love and prayer.
Back to the point,
I have to meet my needs before I can help anyone else. Sometimes my husband sees and helps me and that frees me to then help him as I am aware and able to help him. He is one of my valuable relationships. So, I want to give him a higher percentage of my time.
Life is difficult and demanding at times, BP or not. Life is about learning and growing to be better,
as opposed to giving up.
I believe we need to take time to mourn our losses. Then get up, ready to fight for what is ours by arming ourselves with love and helpful information.
As for Dave’s friend… I’m certain you (Dave) will know exactly how to help him, when the time comes!
vlc
MARAG, to be with a bipolar man you need to have 3 basic qualities: 1. Love (understanding, consideration, compassion), 2. Patience (lots of it) and 3. Sense of Humour. These are all equally important. Of course it helps enormously if your man is getting the right treatment and medication.
I have experience of both: My ex-husband refuses to get help and would never admit to having a mental problem. I was knocking my head against a brick wall trying to get him to a doctor and he turned around saying it was me who has the problem not him. He blamed me for everything and when it looked like I could get him treatment he left me, in fear of it. We are not together now, but still in touch. Towards the end of last year he was euphoric and full of crazy ideas again, while now he is in a deep depression – currently staying in a hostel. I’m hoping that (I’m sounding mean here, but sure you know it’s not meant that way) he hits rock bottom or does something really mad, so someone will notice and forces him to get help and treatment.
My boyfriend never made a secret of his bipolar disorder. He told me the first night we met. To be honest, at first I was fighting against my feelings for him, telling myself “Don’t fall for it again. You’ve been there, done that.” Now I love this man very much. He is on the right prescriptions and never misses taking his medicine. Although his episodes are minor ones, I accept that he has them and bipolar is part of him. We are developing our relationship slowly. For now we live 30 minutes walk from each other. We usually meet 3 or 4 times a week. Sometimes when he is down, he doesn’t want to see or speak to anyone (we still keep in touch by text and I try to cheer him up) for a whole week or more. I have to accept that, too, knowing that it will pass and we will enjoy each other’s company again before long.
Maybe it would be better for you and your man to live in different houses and it would certainly help your relationship if his doctor put him on the right medicine.
Good luck!
Hi David, I am so glad my kids are the only family I have. I would hate it if I caused someone to feel they were over worked, or guilty for helping me. I guess you have the option of loving unconditionally, or feel sorry for yourself because your other half emptied your bank account. If it is so unbearable, leave!Thanks David, Karen
I think your decision NOT to help your friend until/unless he becomes a danger to himself or others – is smart! Like you said, you HAVE to have priorities in life, and this man, though a friend, is NOT family, nor is he YOUR responsibility. You have enough “irons in the fire” that are more important, and it seems his supporters are “denying” the problem. Be kind to yourself, Dave; you don’t have to save the world – just your little corner of it!
As far as bipolar people taking responsibility for themselves AFTER an episode – I have been suddenly thrust into that position in very harsh ways. I married my first husband 7 years after my last episode (hospitalization), and made being his wife my highest priority. Then, my Mother came to live with us for 4 years in the early stages of Alzheimer’s, and SHE became MY responsibility.
We ultimately had to put her in a nursing home. But – during that time, my husband died. I was left without a supporter for the first time in my life. I managed with the “support” of the local Community Mental Health clinic, and applied for, and got, Social Security Disability.
But – I still had the responsibilitiy of being a landlord in my apartment house for the next 15 years. In the late 1990s, I lived with and ultimately married my second husband. We were each other’s supporters, because he had a mental illness as well. It worked out great: I had someone to “watch over me.”
When he died in 2003, I was struck dumb. It was as if my arm had been amputated and I was a shell of my former self. Two years later, because of all the memories we had shared in the house, I bought and moved into a condo close to where I had lived.
I am STILL my own “supporter” who has to make priorities to stay stable. It’s a daily struggle with my moods; thank God, I’m NOT a rapid cycler! I follow a treatment plan, but have cut ALL negative people out of my life, and surrounded myself with helpful, and hopeful, friends. It is important to recognize your “triggers” and manage your stressors; the decision to do ONE thing that is too much stress can ruin a lifetime of “maintenance.”
I KNOW from experience.
BIG HUGS to all bipolar survivors and those who love them. Stay sane, and may God bless you real good.
I’m sorry for turning in to a problem like this with my family but I can say I feel a little stronger not as weak mentally with their support and I’ve found many good suggestions from you links not all do I agree with but there are many good ones…Thanks For Taking your time it is very important to someone like myself…Moon
I believe you should tell your children about the disorder. I know my step children are much less confused now that it is out in the open. Granted, my step children are 17, 15, and 13 so they are old enough to kind of understand. The 13 year old understands the best. She is epileptic so she completely understands that there is something wrong that no one can see on the outside. Strangely enough, they are a bigger support for me than my own family. We sat down and explained everything to them, then let them ask questions. It worked out pretty well. They help keep me on my toes when it comes to my medications, my therapist appointments, they even try to help pull me out of my down cycles (which are still often). Unfortunately my doctor and I are still toying with dosages for my lithium and seroquel. My biggest problem is I rapid-cycle. The episodes are finally getting farther apart but it has taken a year to go from 4-5 cycles per week down to 1-2. My bosses at work know about my condition which helps. They don’t cut me any slack about days off but they do change my assignments in the plant when I am having a bad day. In closing I just want to say how much these newsletters have helped me down the proper road for my treatment plan. Thanks Dave more than you know!!!
Nightlady. A tip. When you want to cheer up your boyfriend when he’s down. Send him a joke or take round a comic video/dvd to watch. NEVER but never, go in all jolly like “What a fine day! Let’s go out and have a good time!” When you’re down, someone telling a joke is fine but when they try to jolly you along, there isn’t anything much more irritating and unhelpful than that! I’m not entirely sure why that is. I suspect it’s because when you’re ona downer, you need peace and quiet, and being WITH someone who is jolly introduces an emotional pressure that is hard to take, from which you want to escape. At least, that’s how it is for me – may not be for all BPs, but it sure is for me! It’s much the same when I talk with anyone being jolly over the telephone. Be as jolly as you like by email! It doesn’t hurt, but face to face, or indirect face to face, and it’s killing me with kindness!
PS
I sometimes think that the depressions are not so much a consequence of BP but a defensive mechanism of the body, to shut down and make your body and mind rest. I’m probably completely wrong, but that’s how it feels sometimes, and may be that would explain why when I’dm depressed I want to stay relaxed in that state rather than have someone pull me out. I don’t want to be that way but I want to come out of it at my own pace.
Does that make sense ot anyone else?
Suzanne, you said, “have cut ALL negative people out of my life, and surrounded myself with helpful, and hopeful, friends. It is important to recognize your “triggers” and manage your stressors…”
By “negative” do you people who are down, who always see the glass half empty, or do you mean ANYONE who has negative effect on you?
I can think of plenty of people who are “positive” in the “glass half full” and “positive thinking – you get what you think you can” kind of way, and boy! Some, not all of them, can really tick me off! They do my moods no good at all and I try as best as I can to keep them at arm’s length!
I’d rather the company of some of my “I’m f@@@ing sick, but I do the best I can…you just HAVE to carry on, don’t you…” friends than those other nutters! (I say nutters because I think all that “… you can be anyone you want …” crap is totally illusional! Yeah, I can be anyone I want in my fantasies, but I I enact them I’ll be hospitalised! “I can save the World! I WILL save the World! Believe me, doctor! You can help me if you want …”) I prefer the others because I know they can empathise with how I feel, and I them, which is a whole lot better than being with some jolly soul who hasn’t a clue how I feel. It dosn’t matter that our survival seems a drudge because we show each other how we survive and get through the bad days even when they are really bad. They DON’T drag me down. If we did we would keep a distance for a while, which is actually what we do because we mostly keep in touch by texting. It’s like, “How are u 2day?” “Crap. Really depressed. Doc put up my meds. What about you?” “Same as U by the sound of it! Only my doc DIDN’T put up my meds. God laugh this, isn’t it!” “Yeah, right! Youg hang in there and take care. “You too, my friend. You too.” And that’s it. It;’s the contact, contact with someone who really understand that is important for me.
But there is one old “friend” who I avoid like the plague because she conbstantly moans, moans, moans and moans … she really DOES drag down! If I feel depressed before I meet her, I wanna “do” myself by the time our social meeting is over!!! She’s like the Chinese water torture, a constant drip drip drip of bad vibes … If I see her again it will be too soon!
To GRAHAM_N: No, I don’t mean the “happy sunshine” kind of positive influences. I mean people like my best woman friend, who has had more than her share of losses this year. She is a Christian counselor (no fee), who doesn’t counsel me, but is my friend. We commisserate over what happens in our lives (good and bad) and how we cope with them.
The “negative” people I got out of my life, were the crack addicts that lived in my apartment house and were “leading me down the primrose path.” They tried to bring me down to their level; always begging for money and MORE money for their habits. I was “friends” with them because of proximity; but my boyfriend, Allan, showed me where they were bleeding me dry with their neediness.
I, too, don’t like the always “jolly-mollies” who tell you that “this too shall pass,””why take meds? You’re all right,””the sun always shines,” etc., etc. I find them too saccharine, and they get on my nerves, too.
But you make some good points in your post, and I agree with you on personalities that grate on one’s nerves!
Suzanne. Excellent! 101% with you on this! I am glad you clarified the point – I suspected this would be your view, but I thought it would be worth elucidating for other readers of this blog, so they don’t get sucked into the Stephen Covey-type of dream world.
Hi Dave:
I just finished reading your email about your friend and I am relieved to know that you didn’t bite into this one, it seems you work way too much anyways. I know the worst boss in the world is to be your own boss! I am very curious as to how your new program of pairing up and mentoring bi-polars. I have a 21 y/o daughter who cannot keep a job for very long and now she doesn’t seem interested in trying, but this sounds like something that would really get her going, but for now she lives in Idaho with me and my bi-polar husband and later on, or so she says, she will be moving to Portland, Oregon when her boyfriend gets a decent place to live. Is this something she could do over the internet or does she need to live close to you? Please let me know, because if this is something she can do that would be wonderful. Thanks a lot for all the info you send to me everyday. The info really helps me out with the situation I am caught up in.
Hi David, I bought a printer with a scanner awhile ago, mine you just put the paper in the copier,hit scan, then it should show up on the screen and mine goes into my HP image zoon and I then have to send it to the program I want which is, word, then you can do anything you want with it. I believe software had to be installed also. I am so glad the Giants won!!! I am a Raider fan, those damn Patriots were getting to cocky. I have another interview tomarrow, 3 hours from my home, an adventure oh my.
Thanks David, Karen
Dave,
i am just like your friend because i didnt know about this disorderand reading all the emails and about your mother i am going through the same thing and i am scared i have started a new relationship and hes wonderful because i have these episodes with him all the time and he is still here for me and i thank god every day for him to be in my lifeand reading your emails, the last one you sent was a shock because i am feeling all of this, scared, exhausted,mad, annoyed,frustrated,fearful,worried,doubtful,skeptical,terrified,sad,wondering,dreading. thanks a lot for the information it helps when i can read about bipolar dont stop sending me emails. thanks alot.
Responding to a few of Dave’s comments from the last few days. The biggest problem I am having is trying to figure what is my girlfriend’s personality versus what is her bipolar…For weeks now, we have been stuck on the issue of me “not listening to her” and not “validating her feelings.” I have tried everything possible to validate and listen, using tools we’ve learned from various relationship classes (we’re taking classes right now on that matter) and psychology affirmation books and going to counseling sessions. We’ve reached a point now, where she has accumulated anger and rage at me for “not listening…She just thinks about “a time” that I wasn’t listening (even if it was a month ago) and blows up and threatens me that I’m causing her to hurt herself because I’m not validating her feelings (even if it was a month ago)…now she has been threatening suicide…so I called her mom immediately and got her mom to talk to her, and instantly, she calmed down and her mood reversed to now “she loved me and could never live without me.” I am seeing that her mom can instantly bring calm to her. but I cannot…I am taking the sucide talks very seriously, but her mom doesn’t seem to…her mom can calm her down and then she tells her mom that she is fine and her mom then accepts that she is fine…is it possible that person with bipolar can use “sucide language” to try to get something? This was the first time I got her mom involved because she wouldn’t tell her mom or the rest of her family about these suicide thoughts…now that I’ve made her mom aware, her mom still doesn’t seem to be as concerned as I am…as of today, my girlfriend is back at work and I feel like the past weekend was one big bipolar episode…but it will happen again (I know) the minute I screw up and not validate a feeling she has…I am not perfect…I will screw up again unintentionally, and fail…and when she says something and I misinterpret or don’t agree (because she says I wasn’t listening) will set off another giant episode…As of right now, she is OK because I took all the responsibility (for not listening) and put myself down tremendously…in fact, she had me repeat verbatum exactly everything I did wrong (according to her) (and had me take the ownership that I sent her into episode, although she doesn’t call it an episode…she calls it her feelings) and she had me repeat back (like a robot) word for word everything she deemed me for doing wrong in order to get her to be OK…I am not allowed to ever disagree with her…the only way to keep her calm is to agree with everything she says…I am at the point where when she speaks to me, I have to drop whatever I’m doing, because if I don’t, “I am not listening.” and I know what happens if I am not listening… Therefore, the rest of my life is becoming out of control because I can’t attend to it…
Brian.
Your said, “…is it possible that person with bipolar can use “sucide language” to try to get something?” My wife did it and she’s not even Bipolar! But maybe she was “disturbed” at the time. I don’t know. Nevertheless, I’ve little doubt I was being manipulated, and it worked. The fact that she responds so well to her Mum and not to you suggests she may well be manipulating you. The trouble is you won’t know if she’s bluffing until you call thre bluff! And then, even if she “attempted” suicide, that wouldn’t mean she meant to kill herself – some people do use suicide “attempts” to manipulate others. (“Don’t leave me or I will kill myself …” OD on pills knowing they will be found in time … except that sometimes goes wrong because the person who’s meant to find them comes home late!)
You’ll have to judge for yourself if she’s manipulating you. Only you (and maybe her Mum?) know here well enough to make an educated guess on this.
Good luck, mate!
this is for brian,
you have reminded me of another relationship I’m very familiar with…You just described, exactly, their problem…it was interesting to read your description as it fit so well! (but switch the genders – it`s the nam with BP.
He was often unreasonably offended by his partner`s individual opinion. – not over big issues – it was little things…differences that could be accepted or might serve to start a discussion, maybe, but certainly not cause offence! And he would remember and bring up these small things and use then as a barrier to further discussion…She found herself apologizing and trying to restate her feelings over and over…
he finally requested “space” as he felt that maybe they weren`t compatible after all…(these were really minor issues! out of the blue…
…but she still obviously loves him and wants to support him and they still talk…
I am so grateful for this website – you all share so much that is helping be bridge the gap between my loved one with BP and myself…and by accident I found another website for my friend that might help you…narcissismcured.com. I don`t agree with all they say – but it was a real insight for my friend and they`ve been extremely helpful and supportive for her. I`ve contacted them also and found them very helpful.
GRAHAM, Thanks for your advice. I totally agree with you. When you’re down you want something to take your mind off it a bit and I have used the funny film or joke therapy for many years for myself and others and it usually works. People who are very jolly while you’re down are as helpful as flies buzzing around your head when you’re trying to relax. The only people worse than that are the patronising “Oh you poor thing, let me kiss it better!” types. Moaners do drag you down, too. You need to have empathy and give people space when they need it. I believe in “Do as you would be done by.”
One thing I really hate is the phrase “Cheer up, it might never happen!” When I feel depressed or upset it’s usually for a reason. Either, because it’s already happened. Or you realise that something you really wish to happen might never happen.
My boyfriend and I do a lot of texting and by now I can tell what mood he is in, regardless of the message. 3 or more xxx means “I love you lots, cu asap.” 1 or 2 x means “I’m ok (maybe a little down), cu soon.” No x means “I’m feeling crappy and want to be left alone. Cu when I’m better.” The last couple of nights I just had vague messages with 1 x and I know what it may lead to. So I will wait for him to contact me when he is ready.
you guys are all really encouraging – thanks for your honesty.
To Graham N.
It isn’t a episode, it is only a philosophy of life. Karma is a reault of and action made in the pass or in other life.The necessity of help come from our inner soul.You can do or not.I’m a lay, a single support, but I can express what I think.If I understand in first place, you blame yourself for a suicide as it been could be impeached.In second place ,but not whithout importance, you was very satisfy with the born of two beautiful child,but not with the means.You is a very inteligent and sensitive person.You have had prejudice about help a girl 16 old ,but you was only 20 years old,I think young too, and without knowing what to do.I underestand that ? Really it wasn’t your fault.Just happened, unfortunately…Go ahead,don’t think to much in this things, and pray.Lilian P.
Hi Lillian
My sincere thanks for your response and kindness (not to mention the compliment!)
You said, “It isn’t a episode, it is only a philosophy of life. Karma is a result of and action made in the pass or in other life.” Actually, Karma can be the result of an action in the SAME life span. At least, that is what I have been taught by a Tibetan Buddhist Rinpoche. It was explained to me we have some measure of choice in when we “repay” the dues, thence it is possible for an individual to attain “enlightenment” and escape from the cycle of rebirth with a lifetime.
You also said, “…you blame yourself for a suicide…”
I did, but I don’t blame myself for it now – I now understand this death was not “my” fault. What bothers me is that I did not do enough to help the girl’s suffering as that WAS within my power. That does not mean I could have stopped the suicide; but it means I could have TRIED HARDER to relieve some of her distress. After all, she wanted me to do so, and that small step alone would have made some contribution to lighten a corner of the darkness she was facing. I had done this before, for others. I even did it in my first year in school, when I was about 5 years old! Even then I recognised it was possible for me, for anyone, to make a difference and help others into a measure of light.
I would not say that I choose to remember this event. I am reminded of it from time to time. (The sight of a railway line is often enough to jog my memory, or seeing news reports of others who have died in similar circumstances.) But I view it like mankind’s history – if we remember what happened, it is more likely we will not allow history to repeat itself! Of course, it usually does, especially in the affairs of politics, policy and creativity, but I am determined to work hard so my history should not be repeated. Thus, I DO go forward but with an eye out for circumstances that may be similar with those of my past, and where I might be able to make a difference, I will try to do so … and not run away. THAT is why I am here, writing on this blog. Trying to make a difference.
I respect the belief, that you may share, in an omnipotent supreme being, creator or manager. My own conception of God is more akin to the belief of the Jains or Buddhists, of a universal, eternal energy that is everything, of which we humans are a transitory, ever changing manifestation. Thence, the secret of Life, the potential for grasping infinite knowledge and wisdom is within every person, if we could only “see” it. Therefore, I do not pray; instead, I “look” within for my answers. (Amusing! There is a Zen training manual which is called “Selling Water by a River,” which essentially means it is not actually necessary to train as a Zen Buddhist to become “enlightened” (buying water) – the ultimate learning is there all the time, if only we opened our eyes to it (in the river.) My eyes are still too tightly closed!
Which reminds me … forgive me for going a bit of track, and if I repeat this: The first bottled water to be sold in the UK was a brand called Evian. Try reading that backwards … I think of this as summary of the lesson of selling water by a river!
May Eternal peace be your One Experience!
Hi Brian,
I get angry ,upset,mad,frustrated when my boyfriend dont listen to me but he listens to everyword and then would say something then he would repeat what i said and i would say i didnt say that but he would be right so i just leave it alone and be happy again because thats what you have to do is listen to her and then repeat what she said then she will calm down just try that and if it works or not let me know.
dear david,
can you recommend a counselor – or is there someone on this blog who would be willing to speak to me asap? (graham, nightlady, suzannewa?) I have a situation on my hands that I need to discuss. my partner often reads these blogs – so can`t share anymore here. It’s pretty urgent.
If anyone can help, my e-mail is quetzalfree@yahoo.com
thanks,
marag
David, I totally agree w you that as a supporter you have to have LIMITS – everyone has to! DELEGATE when you are about to get tapped out-I’m sure you already do like w your employees. If your friend ever asks you for help, I’m sure you would do so and help his family access correct help. You can’t let yourself get burned out or else you are unable to help anyone.